View Full Version : Clarification on the recent 'hacking' event
skunk
05-09-2010, 11:47 AM
Instead of answering questions in 5 different threads I figured it would be best to create a new thread.
I would like to clarify some misconceptions that a handful of members seem to be having.
AmKon has not been hacked.
No one's bank accounts have been hacked.
One member by the name of boycotteverything (and socks) has been compromised.
I assume he used the same password for all of his accounts, and it would not take a genius to figure out which ones he used.
The posts/private messages made by generalstriker or any of BE's other accounts within the past few days were not BE.
They were made by the hacker posing as BE.
If people are concerned their accounts will be hacked, I would recommend resetting your passwords. Make sure your passwords are AT LEAST 8 characters long, and include numbers and letters.
Do not use proper nouns or words as your password.
I would recommend a random selection of letters and numbers, something like jg8nd93sdfi.
That will make it much easier to gain access to your account.
Also, if you have used your email at any other sites, and are worried that your email will be hacked, just change your email in the usercp.
Create a new one from a free email site (gmail, yahoo, hotmail, etc) and start using that one for amkon.
Please do not start spreading rumors if you are not sure what happened.
This is a conspiracy board, and I know people are already slightly paranoid as it is. We do not need any more fear to be spread unnecessarily.
Jackinthebox
05-09-2010, 12:27 PM
What about my username being altered?
WhispersInTheDark
05-09-2010, 01:53 PM
I would recommend a random selection of letters and numbers, something like jg8nd93sdfi.
I remember simpler times before algorithmic password hacks were the order of the day.
Just one thing. Won't it compromise security if we all use the same password you have suggested here?
(runs away).
Trauma Teased
05-09-2010, 02:00 PM
Won't it compromise security of we all use the same password you have suggested here?
(runs away).
Security HAS already been compromised, and the WITD account has obviously been hacked. I was actually able to understand the above post.
Yeah, you better run, damn hacker!
:D
I'll use g8nd93sdfij instead. Close enough.
Trauma Teased
05-09-2010, 02:04 PM
I'll use g8nd93sdfij instead. Close enough.
I will just use some cool Norwegian letters you guys don't know about.
:p
Chorlton
05-09-2010, 02:15 PM
I will just use some cool Norwegian letters you guys don't know about.
:p
I'll use French Letters :rolleyes:
Trauma Teased
05-09-2010, 02:19 PM
I'll use French Letters :rolleyes:
Hey, limey, what are you doing here? Shouldn't you be busy making the avatars work again over at HM?
Dømrade dåsemikkel.
MERDE!
Chorlton
05-09-2010, 03:17 PM
Hey, limey, what are you doing here? Shouldn't you be busy making the avatars work again over at HM?
Dømrade dåsemikkel.
MERDE!
Oh I just like to come here and hang out with the lower classes sometimes.:D
captainkiwi
05-09-2010, 03:28 PM
will the real hacker please stand up
ZZrY1jMcmO0
Lexion
05-09-2010, 03:31 PM
Good to see ya, Chorlton.
You've been missed.
And yes, I'm White Trash.
:D
Chorlton
05-09-2010, 03:35 PM
Good to see ya, Chorlton.
You've been missed.
And yes, I'm White Trash.
:D
You too Lex
captainkiwi
05-09-2010, 03:42 PM
the truth is BE hacked himself with one or other of his socks that he lost control of while making the switch for one foot to the next and with as many socks as he has it's no suprise he can't find a pair when he needs to go out for a wee troll
Oh I just like to come here and hang out with the lower classes sometimes.:D
Back to your root's . . . .lol ;)
Can you put crossdresser under this users name that has been posing as GS, BE, BE2 . . . and any other name . . . best we know whom we are annoying/ chatting to . . . .
I'm glad there a 3rd entity . . . as if he hadn't exposed himself, god know's were this madness would of led to . . .
I'm sure a few are biting there tongues, the one's that have been dragged in via e-mail . . .will be WTF is going on . .. . which is more than understandable . . . about all one can do is try to support skunk, as I'm sure this is driving him fucken crazy to . . . :popcorn:
skunk
05-09-2010, 10:34 PM
What about my username being altered?
Some joker is having fun with an ajax exploit in live topic. Once live topic turns off, the name changes back.
Relatively harmless "fun"...
skunk
05-09-2010, 10:36 PM
I'll put a spoiler around the posts the imposter made with a disclaimer that this is not the real BE.
I'll put a spoiler around the posts the imposter made with a disclaimer that this is not the real BE.
A very honourable thing do to for BE's sake Skunk, I know he will appreciate that :D
Posted over at HM:
(http://www.hoaxmasters.com/viewtopic.php?p=1075#p1075)
http://www.hoaxmasters.com/styles/prosilver_se/imageset/icon_post_target.gif (http://www.hoaxmasters.com/viewtopic.php?p=1075#p1075)by (http://www.hoaxmasters.com/viewtopic.php?p=1075#p1075)boycotteverything (http://www.hoaxmasters.com/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=89) » Sun May 09, 2010 3:14 pm
Did it. It would be nice if someone at Amkon could concisely explain what happened over there with the hacker. I'd also like to see them warren all the posts made in my name by the guy. People responded to them as if they were mine even after they were shown to be fraudulent by Skunk. Unbelievable. Interestingly enough he was the only one who actually believed me. I've gained a new respect for him.
(http://www.hoaxmasters.com/viewtopic.php?p=1075#p1075)
Funny BE, whether we believed or didn't you were pissed. yesterday I asked if it was the real you BE2 (GS isn't real and all that horseshit) and you are pissed. And YOU WONDER why...
skunk
05-09-2010, 10:54 PM
The only people who could really verify if that was him or not would've been the admins though, I don't quite get why he'd be mad at everyone else.
The stress of the situation maybe.
Not being believed.
Yep, That would seem true.
He wanted people to proclaim a certain user was the culprit. Unlike him, many of us don't just accuse someone 'just because'.
Yep, That would seem true.
He wanted people to proclaim a certain user was the culprit. Unlike him, many of us don't just accuse someone 'just because'.
Very true!
Just show the rat picked his/her targets well . . . game, set . . .can we prevent match . . . :D
MissSilver
05-09-2010, 11:16 PM
Yep, That would seem true.
He wanted people to proclaim a certain user was the culprit. Unlike him, many of us don't just accuse someone 'just because'.
Or didn't care.
The stress of the situation maybe.
Not being believed.
funny that. he lied about being IP banned and then gets pissed at everyone for not believing him when something actually does happen.
Huge dose of Karma....anyone?
Jackinthebox
05-10-2010, 12:42 AM
Some joker is having fun with an ajax exploit in live topic. Once live topic turns off, the name changes back.
Relatively harmless "fun"...
Okay, I gotcha. I did notice that it wasn't everywhere, in fact limited to certain specific posts. Thought that was pretty weird.
And to whoever did it, fuck you scumbag. :D
s0c1a7xpl01t
05-10-2010, 12:45 AM
OH NOEZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!
L33T NWO REPTILIANS MUST HAVE DONE IT!!!
OH NOEZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!
L33T NWO REPTILIANS MUST HAVE DONE IT!!!
nah....just a lame wannebe internet hero.
s0c1a7xpl01t
05-10-2010, 01:22 AM
nah....just a lame wannebe internet hero.
Nah no hero............. Just doing my thing.
rofl.
your thing.
nice.
why don't you go fuck with the nsa or something useful.
Jedimiller
05-10-2010, 01:33 AM
i dont have any proof of this....but i get the feeling the hacker is ief...anyone notice hes not around? i may be right and someone ban that fucker...
s0c1a7xpl01t
05-10-2010, 01:38 AM
rofl.
your thing.
nice.
why don't you go fuck with the nsa or something useful.
Haha NSA useful! What universe do you live in?
Nah I do my thing on my own...
s0c1a7xpl01t
05-10-2010, 01:40 AM
i dont have any proof of this....but i get the feeling the hacker is ief...anyone notice hes not around? i may be right and someone ban that fucker...
Haha I cant let somebody else take the fall for me.
This is not IEF.
Sorry jedi dude. go back to your incest movies.
:tin:
6IPAGXyFvrs
i dont have any proof of this....but i get the feeling the hacker is ief...anyone notice hes not around? i may be right and someone ban that fucker...
Jedi .... Im getting repressed sexual tension coming through quite strong here in that statement .... whats the real deal with you and IEF?
Jedimiller
05-10-2010, 01:44 AM
Haha I cant let somebody else take the fall for me.
This is not IEF.
Sorry jedi dude. go back to your incest movies.
:tin:
6IPAGXyFvrs
lol...well..can you delete his acount for me? i would much appreciate it if u did...game?
s0c1a7xpl01t
05-10-2010, 01:46 AM
lol...well..can you delete his acount for me? i would much appreciate it if u did...game?
Nah he never did nothing to me.
MissSilver
05-10-2010, 01:50 AM
i dont have any proof of this....but i get the feeling the hacker is ief...anyone notice hes not around? i may be right and someone ban that fucker...
That is just fucking low Jedi.
That is just fucking low Jedi.
I think Jediii was doing "humour" there Miss S ... :)
hard to tell I know .... buit thats how I read it :)
MissSilver
05-10-2010, 02:06 AM
I meant to quote that...
lol...well..can you delete his acount for me? i would much appreciate it if u did...game?
This is what I meant by low.
I meant to quote that...
This is what I meant by low.
yeah ... thats it,... was that attempted humour Jeddeye?
Oblivion
05-10-2010, 02:48 AM
rofl.
why don't you go fuck with the nsa or something useful.
because a low life admin with no morals, who's been abusing his position of trust to "one up" those he battles with here has gone and pissed off someone, somewhere else, who has decided to track him down and fuck with him in return.
pack bought the trouble here by creating trouble elsewhere..
so much for the guy hating drama, amkon standards slipping etc.. seems he is what he hates.
pack3tg0st
05-10-2010, 03:06 AM
because a low life admin with no morals, who's been abusing his position of trust to "one up" those he battles with here has gone and pissed off someone, somewhere else, who has decided to track him down and fuck with him in return.
pack bought the trouble here by creating trouble elsewhere..
so much for the guy hating drama, amkon standards slipping etc.. seems he is what he hates.
I Love you too 'bliv :)
http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00781/ManKiss-682_781955a.jpg
funny that. he lied about being IP banned and then gets pissed at everyone for not believing him when something actually does happen.
Huge dose of Karma....anyone?
I don't know think he lied about being IP banned, man. He didn't know. His profile was hijacked. That may have been when it was done. He should not have jumped to conclusions about Skunk, who is a good guy. Obviously, he and skunk have had their issues in the past, skunk is admin and so he jumped to the conclusion that skunk did it. I'll agree, BE should have asked him first but it's understandable. The two of them have seem to come, at least, to a ceasefire and hopefully a new beginning - where they can, hopefully, make fun of each other in a more good natured way.
I think he was pissed at other people because no one believed him - not no, but few.
I don't blame people for not jumping to conclusions about skunk, at all. But, no one seemed to believe the guy couldn't log on through no fault of his own.
Anyway, I think that's why he was pissed - came from being hurt.
I know myself and others just got fucked with from somebody and I was pissed off. And, myself, and others, jumped to conclusions.
For what it's worth....
anarch
05-10-2010, 03:13 AM
E3dj3TJ1r9A
I don't know think he lied about being IP banned, man. He didn't know. His profile was hijacked. That may have been when it was done. He should not have jumped to conclusions about Skunk, who is a good guy. Obviously, he and skunk have had their issues in the past, skunk is admin and so he jumped to the conclusion that skunk did it. I'll agree, BE should have asked him first but it's understandable. The two of them have seem to come, at least, to a ceasefire and hopefully a new beginning - where they can, hopefully, make fun of each other in a more good natured way.
I think he was pissed at other people because no one believed him - not no, but few.
I don't blame people for not jumping to conclusions about skunk, at all. But, no one seemed to believe the guy couldn't log on through no fault of his own.
Anyway, I think that's why he was pissed - came from being hurt.
I know myself and others just got fucked with from somebody and I was pissed off. And, myself, and others, jumped to conclusions.
For what it's worth....
Yes I beleive someone was fucking with BE, but due to blaming skunk, it look like a lie, sadly it is very hard to find who did what, the tangled web was weaved, and it went down hill from their, and now its turning ugly . . .but best not turn on each other, as that his aim I feel . . . :D
Yes I beleive someone was fucking with BE, but due to blaming skunk, it look like a lie, sadly it is very hard to find who did what, the tangled web was weaved, and it went down hill from their, and now its turning ugly . . .but best not turn on each other, as that his aim I feel . . . :D
I agree, lala. :compress:
But, no one seemed to believe the guy couldn't log on through no fault of his own.
...
normally i would agree with you egg, in fact i stood up for BE behind the scenes any number of times over the past 2 and a bit years.
yet i saw the logs, at the time he claimed he couldn't log on to amkon he was hiding in the shadows watching the recent topics and posting on peoples walls.
thats a lie imho.
WhispersInTheDark
05-10-2010, 06:40 AM
I have personally been baptised into a Christian church, initiated into two Hindu sects and many different Orders, and been ceremonially connected into eternity with an esoteric school that migrated from Paris to NYC.
Despite his failings and what may appear to be human foibles, our own prophet will continue to have a column of defencse and a semi-loyal following at Amkon.
I have personally been baptised into a Christian church, initiated into two Hindu sects and many different Orders, and been ceremonially connected into eternity with an esoteric school that migrated from Paris to NYC.
Despite his failings and what may appear to be human foibles, our own prophet will continue to have a column of defencse and a semi-loyal following at Amkon.
there can only be one prophet.
The House of the Saviour (aka) The Two Tone Church of the Perfectly Imperfect. (http://mojo.amkon.net/)
Cogburn
05-10-2010, 06:52 AM
... our own prophet will continue to have a column of defencse and a semi-loyal following at Amkon.
Yeah, but that's pretty much the M.O. of all conspiracy theory.
Jedimiller
05-10-2010, 07:10 AM
Well, is it over? or is it still going on?
there can only be one prophet.
for me its the "chink",
"You have taught us much. Come with us and join the movement."
"This movement of yours, does it have slogans?" inquired the Chink.
"Right on!" they cried. And they quoted him some.
"Your movement, does it have a flag?" asked the Chink.
"You bet!" and they described their emblem.
"And does your movement have leaders?"
"Great leaders."
"Then shove it up your butts," said the Chink. "I have taught you nothing."
"Sissy: You really don't believe in political solutions do you?
The Chink: I believe in political solutions to political problems. But man's primary problems aren't political; they're philosophical. Until humans can solve their philosophical problems, they're condemned to solve their political problems over and over and over again. It's a cruel, repetitious bore.
Sissy: Well, then, what are the philosophical solutions?
The Chink: Ha ha ho ho and hee hee. That's for you to find out. I'll say this much and no more: there's got to be poetry. And magic. At every level. If civilization is ever going to be anything but a grandiose pratfall, anything more than a can of deodorizer in the shithouse of existence, then statesmen are going to have to concern themselves with magic and poetry. Bankers are going to have to concern themselves with magic and poetry. Time magazine is going to have to write about magic and poetry. Factory workers and housewives are going to have to get their lives entangled in magic and poetry.
Sissy: Do you think such a thing can ever happen?
The Chink: If you understood poetry and magic, you'd know that it doesn't matter."
MrPenny
05-10-2010, 08:26 AM
at the time he claimed he couldn't log on to amkon he was hiding in the shadows watching
Oh yeah? It was his IP address for sure......but I wonder if he's one of those numbnuts who uses the same password, literally everywhere. Windows login?
Foxtrot Oscar
05-10-2010, 10:21 AM
Teh Bluff
Teh Doobull Bluff
And Ye Gawds, no one would ever believe I'm that stupid.
"'Tis a cunning plan m'lord."
Anymore turnips Baldrick?
Fox
Chorlton
05-10-2010, 10:33 AM
Is it a cunning plan from Professor Cunning of Cunning University
apeci
05-10-2010, 09:40 PM
BE had someone ELSE'S hand up his ass? Oooooooh no you di'int.
MissA
05-10-2010, 10:27 PM
I meant to quote that...
This is what I meant by low.
Why would that be "low" versus "funny"? He'd have to come back as EIF or FIE.
torbjon
05-10-2010, 10:33 PM
What would that be "low" versus "funny"? He'd have to come back as EIF or FIE.
FIE? 'ell, I'd settle for M O U S E
QNK5KzI48mM
skunk
05-11-2010, 10:36 PM
Okay, I gotcha. I did notice that it wasn't everywhere, in fact limited to certain specific posts. Thought that was pretty weird.
And to whoever did it, fuck you scumbag. :D
They won't be having any more fun, the bug has been fixed.
skunk
05-11-2010, 10:38 PM
because a low life admin with no morals, who's been abusing his position of trust to "one up" those he battles with here has gone and pissed off someone, somewhere else, who has decided to track him down and fuck with him in return.
pack bought the trouble here by creating trouble elsewhere..
so much for the guy hating drama, amkon standards slipping etc.. seems he is what he hates.
Bliv, this dude has been following pack around for years now. I know you have a personal crusade against pack for one reason or another, I don't particularly give a fuck why though.
skunk
05-11-2010, 10:40 PM
Nah no hero............. Just doing my thing.
Why the need to hide behind tor mr. badass? Afraid of someone h4x1ng your ip?
skunk
05-11-2010, 10:41 PM
Nah he never did nothing to me.
And yet you feel the need to take out your personal grudge with a member here on this website.
What are you 14?
WITCH HUNT
05-12-2010, 01:29 AM
funny that. he lied about being IP banned and then gets pissed at everyone for not believing him when something actually does happen.
Huge dose of Karma....anyone?
Boy who cried wolf, or senile old man yelling at strangers? LMAO
Oblivion
05-12-2010, 08:45 AM
Bliv, this dude has been following pack around for years now. I know you have a personal crusade against pack for one reason or another, I don't particularly give a fuck why though.
so if you dont give a fuck, why bother replying?
personal crusade? only against those who abuse their position of trust and power, and show no respect for the forum or its members.
if thats ok by you, i guess you better not chime in about how you distrust government in other threads then eh?
Bliv- What evidence or understanding of this affair have you developed? I think it's very important that it all comes out and not be swept under the bed. I have my own suspicions and I also note that it's common practice for the mods here (current and former) to support one another unconditionally regardless of the facts or false accusations.
anarch
05-12-2010, 09:58 AM
I remember a certain asshole saying he was sorry about stuff and that he was never comming back.. All of a sudden amkon gets a little programmer trouble and look who comes RUNNING BACK! Just in time to continue to act like a douche and stir shit up as best as a senile old man can....
Fuck it.
Do us all a great favor and put me back on ignore, OK Dr. Rife?
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 10:07 AM
I remember a certain asshole saying he was sorry about stuff and that he was never comming back.. All of a sudden amkon gets a little programmer trouble and look who comes RUNNING BACK! Just in time to continue to act like a douche and stir shit up as best as a senile old man can....
Fuck it.
Haha, Anarch, lot of people have done AmKom iQuits even the short while I have been here. Most iQuits don't last long. Pack also onde swore he would leave if BE left, but Pack came back too, and he did it before BE returned.
Just saying.
Also seems to me that you are doing a bit of shit stirring yourself, with all the name calling, no?
Anarch has no interest in truth. He's a party line STFU refugee with little understanding of free expression. Bliv, on the other hand, has developed an important line of enquiry because he refuses to live with half truth and innuendo regardless of the consequences. Mobs consist of vile and vindictive morons like the Anarch tag team. For mobbed-up mediocrities the lynching and the truth are always identical.
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 10:20 AM
Anarch has no interest in truth. He's a party line STFU refugee with little understanding of free expression.
LOL, at least SHTF people seem to be really good with name calling. Perhaps they offer free classes in it over there.
:D
I'll have to consult with Hazel and get back to you on that. They ain't SHTuppers for nuthin'.
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 10:38 AM
I'll have to consult with Hazel and get back to you on that. They ain't SHTuppers for nuthin'.
Ain't that the truth!
But to raise the literary quality of insults around here, I recommend reading up on Shakespeare's great stuff. Or better yet, use this fantastic Shakespeare Insult Kit!
http://www.pangloss.com/seidel/shake_rule.html
Personally I really hope I can put the word "beslubbering" into good use some day. Or "beetle-headed"!
:D
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 10:42 AM
Thou art but a donkey's pizzle....beslubbering about in a beetle-headed tumult....
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 10:49 AM
Thou art but a donkey's pizzle....beslubbering about in a beetle-headed tumult....
Crap, you beat me too it, thou bat-fowling, flap-mouthed codpiece!
:(
And thus spake the maggot-pie..
Shakespeare Insult Kit now officially in my favorites file. Thankya vurry much.
MissA
05-12-2010, 11:11 AM
The fact is that there is someone here that is paying 90% of the cost of this website, has paid for the VB software for upgrades, etc and has allowed others free usage thereof. From time to time, this non-programmer enlists the help of programmers. Free help.
I think everyone who questions the decisions made by this person ought to look around and notice the non-Google adsense and lack of fundraising and instead of bitching about his choices and/or creating further drama by continuing a fruitless inquisition (it will still come down to who you believe) perhaps people should just say:
Thank you for giving us the opportunity to post freely on this website, without popup ads, without google adsense like ATS and SHTF, and thank you for never reminding us of this fact and bearing the ill will silently.
Because at some point...the person whose name is "on the lease" so to speak might just decide to quit.
Maybe people don't like the way Pack has chosen to conduct himself in the pissing contest with BE...at the very least you can look at the site, the video arcade, the free security plug ins, the lack of bugs, the ease of use and realize that the amount of work done on this website (if someone charged) would be thousands upon thousands of dollars.
Maybe folks don't like how Skunk has decided to stick by Pack but were I Skunk I would hold up the middle finger on that one. "Free" is usually something that endears people to others.
Maybe folks don't like the behavior of their fellow posters, but given the fact that no one dragged any of us to Amkon we need to accept our own complicit acceptance by posting here.
There is not one non-hypocritical leg to stand on if you are posting here. You know the rules, you know its free, you know that this site is a troll haven. Many of the people still beefing tried out other sites, created their own sites, etc but they obviously realize that the game is still here on Amkon. So bitch all you want, but if you really cared you'd stay somewhere else.
It would be nice if people took Ducky's thread about changing the culture from bitch and moan to real investigation with some trolling.
Anyway, as the Romans would say:
caveat emptor
MissA, I gotta basically agree with your points.
MissA
05-12-2010, 11:17 AM
MissA, I gotta basically agree with your points.
Ya say it like that hurts.... ;)
changing the culture from bitch and moan to real investigation with some trolling.Some real investigation is called for- along with the commensurate koidal trolling.
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 11:24 AM
real investigation with some trolling.
But somehow, recent events at Amkon, RU, and Hoaxmasters are not worthy of investigation? Why should this be "hands off"?
Maybe we should appoint some "judge" to determine what can be considered fair targets for outrage or investigation?
Just sayin'
But somehow, recent events at Amkon, RU, and Hoaxmasters are not worthy of investigation? Why should this be "hands off"?
Maybe we should appoint some "judge" to determine what can be considered fair targets for outrage or investigation?
Just sayin'
You're out of line.
A poll to approve or reject the creation of any thread, other than the poll thread for thread creation. :)
A poll to approve or reject the creation of any thread, other than the poll thread for thread creation. :)
I love polls, I rarely vote in them but, polls are a good thing :D
But somehow, recent events at Amkon, RU, and Hoaxmasters are not worthy of investigation? Why should this be "hands off"?
Maybe we should appoint some "judge" to determine what can be considered fair targets for outrage or investigation?
Just sayin'Not very Buddhist of you, tovarish. Can't we all just get along?
I love polls, I rarely vote in them but, polls are a good thing :D
According to certain polls, 86.8% of the viewing public like polls but only 68.7% vote in them.
According to certain polls, 86.8% of the viewing public like polls but only 68.7% vote in them.
Shouldn't this information be in the fun figures thread?
The original premise of this thread- based on Skunk's OP-
Instead of answering questions in 5 different threads I figured it would be best to create a new thread.Not a bad idea. Post away, koidal empire.
There was a poster that used to post here, in fact similar name to a new member, that had created a Uni Thread.
Now that is a novel idea, saves moving around from place to place to get information, one area for everything, wish I had thought of that :D
Shouldn't this information be in the fun figures thread?
68% of people polled agree with you.
There was a poster that used to post here, in fact similar name to a new member, that had created a Uni Thread.
Now that is a novel idea, saves moving around from place to place to get information, one area for everything, wish I had thought of that :DThis is the new Ünithread™.
MissA
05-12-2010, 11:44 AM
But somehow, recent events at Amkon, RU, and Hoaxmasters are not worthy of investigation? Why should this be "hands off"?
Maybe we should appoint some "judge" to determine what can be considered fair targets for outrage or investigation?
Just sayin'
I don't believe that I said it should have been "hands off". I believe my argument is that it is settled to the satisfaction of the site owner. I think Skunk and Chorlton investigated the hacker, made decisions for the best interests of the site(s) and produced a report thread for everyone of their findings.
Those who still feel uneasy have the option of leaving. Those that continue to bitch and moan about the problems they are having with a "free" service seem rather ungrateful considering the amount of free effort that went in to securing the site.
Further investigation could only be done by someone with the skill sets to do so, someone like HP or Pack, someone he would have to pay anywhere from $150 to 300 an hour. If someone wishes to pony up the expense to investigate it thoroughly, then that is when you will see me supporting the "investigation". A rough estimate would be that it will cost you $900 to $1000 to sort this when paying a white hat their hourly rate.
It is a free free free website because of the efforts of others and the out of pocket expenses of others. The dollars that we introduce don't make a dent in what this site would have cost if they had to pay a developer for the work done on it.
At a certain point we must decide do we trust Skunk or do we not trust him? If we don't then there is a little "x" on the tab that allows us to close the window.
That is the reality of it.
Those who still feel uneasy have the option of leaving. not very helpful.
I don't believe that I said it should have been "hands off". I believe my argument is that it is settled to the satisfaction of the site owner. I think Skunk and Chorlton investigated the hacker, made decisions for the best interests of the site(s) and produced a report thread for everyone of their findings.
Those who still feel uneasy have the option of leaving. Those that continue to bitch and moan about the problems they are having with a "free" service seem rather ungrateful considering the amount of free effort that went in to securing the site.
Further investigation could only be done by someone with the skill sets to do so, someone like HP or Pack, someone he would have to pay anywhere from $150 to 300 an hour. If someone wishes to pony up the expense to investigate it thoroughly, then that is when you will see me supporting the "investigation". A rough estimate would be that it will cost you $900 to $1000 to sort this when paying a white hat their hourly rate.
It is a free free free website because of the efforts of others and the out of pocket expenses of others. The dollars that we introduce don't make a dent in what this site would have cost if they had to pay a developer for the work done on it.
At a certain point we must decide do we trust Skunk or do we not trust him? If we don't then there is a little "x" on the tab that allows us to close the window.
That is the reality of it.
I trust Skunk. It's the hackers and stealers of people passwords, I could do without.
It is a free free free website because of the efforts of othersI guess I must be at least one of them 'others' after 17,000 free posts. Eh?
MissA
05-12-2010, 11:52 AM
not very helpful.
Very helpful actually. It is the power of choice and exercising it. No one is forcing anyone to post here, nor is anyone begging anyone to post here.
The site owner has put a lot of his own money into keeping this site afloat when this site was supposed to be community owned. He is like the guy who is forced to use his credit card to pay for a dinner because everyone only has hundreds on them and never ever gets reimbursed. To utilize that analogy further, not only did we not help pay for dinner but we ate seven courses then bitched about the meal after.
The other honorable option is to pony up money to pay a white hat to perform an additional investigation if Skunk's assessment is disagreeable. If anyone wishes to do that I am all for that and would applaud the effort.
I think we're more than capable of doing our own 'investigation.'
The other honorable option is to pony up money to pay a white hat to perform an additional investigation if Skunk's assessment is disagreeable. If anyone wishes to do that I am all for that and would applaud the effort.
A month or two ago, this came up on another thread. I know a few of us, at least, offered to pony up. They said, all's paid for for some time. When the bill comes up, I'm sure some of us would be willing to donate to the cause.
I've donated a few times. I'm sure others have too. The costs are minimal.
MissA
05-12-2010, 11:55 AM
I guess I must be at least one of them 'others' after 17,000 free posts. Eh?
If this site were utilizing Google adsense then the 17,000 free posts would definitely be helpful were they quality posts that drove SEO traffic to the website.
As is those 17,000 posts are for your enjoyment as the pleasure and benefit of such is always in the eyes of the beholder. Some will enjoy them, others find them painful as is the case with all our posts.
My posting here does not put money in Skunk's pocket to pay for the expenses of this website. Money in Skunk's pocket does that.
Cross-site scripting holes are web application vulnerabilities that allow attackers to bypass client-side security mechanisms normally imposed on web content by modern browsers. By finding ways of injecting malicious scripts into web pages, an attacker can gain elevated access privileges to sensitive page content, session cookies, and a variety of other information maintained by the browser on behalf of the user. Cross-site scripting attacks are therefore a special case of code injection.
Now closed.
My posting here does not put money in Skunk's pocket to pay for the expenses of this website. Money in Skunk's pocket does that. He's been asked before for an accounting of how much he's contributed. The members are always more than willing to re-reimburse him. If he's confided that amount to you, please let us know.
I discovered I made a huge mistake and there is nothing I can do about it now.
I purchased some cool looking fish, thought their maximum size would be 3". They swim so fast and are a hoot to watch but..... they devoured several of my smaller fish.
I did some after the fact research and now find that they will actually grow to 14".
They swim so fast I would never be able to catch them now.
I guess I will have to wait until they get a bit bigger and drag out a fishing rod :D
MissA
05-12-2010, 12:01 PM
I've donated a few times. I'm sure others have too. The costs are minimal.
Hosting is not minimal for a site this large--but let's say it is. Creating a site like HM is relatively inexpensive, creating a site like this one is not. You have to purchase software like VB (not free). You have to purchase security plug ins (not free).
Security, the games, the coding to ensure that this site functions correctly, add-ons, etc take time...they took hours upon hours of Pack's "I don't take money cuz I'm an anarchist"' time.
Had my girlfriend built this exact same site you would be looking at a bill for $25K based on the going hourly rate of software developers.
Moreover, had the pr0n scandal metamorphosed as it was promised then only one person would be fined and/or arrested and it wouldn't be the posters--even those with 17K plus posts.
I'm not asking people to like Pack. I'm not asking people to like Skunk. I'm asking people to be fair and look closely at what has happened to the site when drama is allowed to reign.
New visitors are not attracted by insider drama so when the thread titles hit the feeds people are just not wanting to check it out. Sites like these need new visitors or they die.
MissA
05-12-2010, 12:05 PM
He's been asked before for an accounting of how much he's contributed. The members are always more than willing to re-reimburse him. If he's confided that amount to you, please let us know.
It is not that it has cost him thousands because he was able to utilize the free coding efforts of Pack--a person that no one seems to like anymore. IF you want the same effort from someone new then you will pay $300 and up for a developer's time. The LOE on a project this size is over 120 FTE hours with monthly updates. The unloaded rate if you were to hire a developer would be around $36K to do what Pack has already done.
The software is about $700 bucks so if people wanted to reimburse him for that...I doubt he would turn it down.
He's been asked before for an accounting of how much he's contributed. The members are always more than willing to re-reimburse him. If he's confided that amount to you, please let us know.
New visitors are not attracted by insider drama so when the thread titles hit the feeds people are just not wanting to check it out. Sites like these need new visitors or they die. We're not here to put on a show for visitors, are we? We've always been a dysfunctional parlor and will remain that way. That's what Koidville means, don'tcha know?
MissA
05-12-2010, 12:09 PM
Koidville changes as people leave, new people enter, and as others return. That is anarchy and equilibrium. Without fresh meat it becomes stale; an exclusive club of inside jokes.
When I first started posting last fall there were far more topical threads and it has slowly changed. Is that bad? Who can say, really. It went from having a lot more continual posters to the same gang every day. Is that bad? Who can say.
It just is.
It will be up to the community to decide, I suppose. I just understand that running my own site was a bother so I appreciate having Amkon to post at.
I discovered I made a huge mistake and there is nothing I can do about it now.
I purchased some cool looking fish, thought their maximum size would be 3". They swim so fast and are a hoot to watch but..... they devoured several of my smaller fish.
I did some after the fact research and now find that they will actually grow to 14".
They swim so fast I would never be able to catch them now.
I guess I will have to wait until they get a bit bigger and drag out a fishing rod :D
Poor little fish. I did that years and years ago (haven't had a fish tank in some time). One fish caused a lot of havoc for the entire tank.
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 12:15 PM
It is a free free free website because of the efforts of others and the out of pocket expenses of others.
That still doesn't justify why inquiries into the situation should be "off limits." If you think it does....hike on over to the "Borg" thread and tell mur to knock it off....'cause OMF is a free site.
Are you seriously suggesting something that has the potential for intrigue, conspiracy, et al....should be ignored simply by virtue of its locality?
No shit....people in forums constantly catching shit for saying "because I said so....", rightfully so, yet that answer absolutely suffices in this instance.
You gotta' be shitting me.
It is interesting to see how these new fish gang up on certain fish and well...... it can sometimes be compared to what happens to people.
What I am hoping for is the new fish to settle in with the others now and live in a peaceful community.
Until of course they grow to 14", then I get out a fishing rod.
MissA
05-12-2010, 12:23 PM
That still doesn't justify why inquiries into the situation should be "off limits." If you think it does....hike on over to the "Borg" thread and tell mur to knock it off....'cause OMF is a free site.
Mr Penny,
when did I say that "inquiries" should be off-limits? Do I even have that power to do so? I don't think I was appointed Dictator of Amkon whilst campaigning in Gaul.
I said that I think that people need to realize that an investigation was conducted, that further investigation will cost money, and that further inquiry than that which has already been done is putting an inordinate amount of pressure on the site owner.
Are you seriously suggesting something that has the potential for intrigue, conspiracy, et al....should be ignored simply by virtue of its locality?
No, I'm stating that people should put their money where their mouth is and hire a white hat if they are going to question Skunk's answers, that's all.
Go right ahead with the inquiry. Just pay for it yourselves.
No shit....people in forums constantly catching shit for saying "because I said so....", rightfully so, yet that answer absolutely suffices in this instance.
You gotta' be shitting me.
Nope, I'm saying that I don't care enough to spend my $$ sorting it, and that none of you who are "inquiring" have the programmatic skills to decipher what happened.
So you can:
1) continue to distrust Skunk's "report" and hire a white hat at $300 an hour,
2) continue to distrust Skunk's "report" and uselessly point fingers without a code assessment
3) trust skunk's assessment and stay
4) distrust skunk's assessment and leave
etc.
Tons of choices. I'm just reminding people that in the middle of this fury are a lot of people who have either contributed $$, or contributed highly marketable skill sets for free and they are being questioned over and over in a manner which seems, to me, to be rather like ingratitude.
Again, this is my opinion...obviously no one takes that seriously or there wouldn't be pics here of bleeding vaginas and dogs.
That still doesn't justify why inquiries into the situation should be "off limits." If you think it does....hike on over to the "Borg" thread and tell mur to knock it off....'cause OMF is a free site.
Are you seriously suggesting something that has the potential for intrigue, conspiracy, et al....should be ignored simply by virtue of its locality?
No shit....people in forums constantly catching shit for saying "because I said so....", rightfully so, yet that answer absolutely suffices in this instance.
You gotta' be shitting me.QFT. Spoken like a true-blue koidal unit.
when did I say that "inquiries" should be off-limits?You just spent the better part of an hour saying exactly that: "STFU or hit the road."
Perhaps, I missed the post when anyone said they distrusted skunk of anything.
Some things are best left unsaid :D
Some things are best left unsaid :D
Such as? ;)
Perhaps, I missed the post when anyone said they distrusted skunk of anything.
I must have missed that too. This thread was started by Skunk for the very purpose it's serving.
I must have missed that too. This thread was started by Skunk for the very purpose it's serving.
That's what I thought. I think the mind control people are at it, again.
There was a way to use XSS. Now there isn't.
There was a way to use XSS. Now there isn't.
What's "xss"?
You didn't read my previous post a page back?
MissA
05-12-2010, 12:35 PM
You just spent the better part of an hour saying exactly that: "STFU or hit the road."
I've spent the better part of an hour trying to present the view of this those of use who are standing outside the various factions are able to see quite clearly.
You are purposefully creating an argument that I am not making. It is not: "STFU or hit the road". It is "STFU or pitch in constructively" with a hint of "STFU or be prepared to look ungrateful."
Anyone can bitch and accuse, very few people can read the code and do the types of investigation this would require to satisfy everyone. That type of investigation costs money.
egg--when people are not satisfied with Skunk's assessment of what went on that implies that they do not trust his assessment.
I am not the only one (others are choosing not to bother because they don't feel things "ever change") who wishes people would stop with the complaining and start acting in a positive and constructive manner.
If it were STFU and hit the road then I wouldn't bother suggesting you hire a white hat hacker for skunk to get to the bottom of it.
You didn't read my previous post a page back?
Actually, I did. But, since I had never heard of "cross-site scripting" before, I wouldn't make the connection between it and xss. Now, I know. Thanks.
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 12:36 PM
1) continue to distrust Skunk's "report" and hire a white hat at $300 an hour,
2) continue to distrust Skunk's "report" and uselessly point fingers without a code assessment
3) trust skunk's assessment and stay
4) distrust skunk's assessment and leave
It isn't about "distrusting" or "trusting" skunk's assessment. It is about the existence of a topic that clearly has some intrigue....some personal investment by some....and has the potential to be viewed in a conspiratorial nature.
I haven't seen anyone suggesting a forensic investigation of event and system logs. No subpoenas have been suggested. What I am seeing is a group of people, with a genesis derived from conspiracy sites and forums doing exactly what comes naturally.
Criminy MissA.....you sound like an ATS moderator.
Sorry, egg, I thought it had the abrev in the write up.
egg--when people are not satisfied with Skunk's assessment of what went on that implies that they do not trust his assessment.
I am not the only one (others are choosing not to bother because they don't feel things "ever change") who wishes people would stop with the complaining and start acting in a positive and constructive manner.
If it were STFU and hit the road then I wouldn't bother suggesting you hire a white hat hacker for skunk to get to the bottom of it.
Or, maybe, as Mr.P said, they're intrigued. Or, maybe, since skunk doesn't know how to code, it is not a distrust of skunk, at all.
Whatever... I don't even know where this is coming from. I'm done with the topic.
Sorry, egg, I thought it had the abrev in the write up.
No problem at all, man.
egg--when people are not satisfied with Skunk's assessment of what went on that implies that they do not trust his assessment.
That's exactly untrue. Skunk's assessment was fine as far as it went. So what is it? 'Accept it as the final word or STFU?' That's what I'm seeing from you here.
MissA
05-12-2010, 12:48 PM
It isn't about "distrusting" or "trusting" skunk's assessment. It is about the existence of a topic that clearly has some intrigue....some personal investment by some....and has the potential to be viewed in a conspiratorial nature.
Yes, and I am weighing in as is everyone else. I think it was as Skunk said it was and am not further invested.
I haven't seen anyone suggesting a forensic investigation of event and system logs.
Nor have I. This was my point. No one is suggesting anything constructive because that would defeat the purpose--which is to have more drama. If someone did I would support that.
No subpoenas have been suggested. What I am seeing is a group of people, with a genesis derived from conspiracy sites and forums doing exactly what comes naturally.
No, this is not conspiracy. This is bitchery.
Criminy MissA.....you sound like an ATS moderator.
No, I sound like someone who is afraid that Skunk may be on the verge of cashing it in and telling all of us to Go Fuck Ourselves.
How do I? I
BE knows if his passwords were the same across multiple web sites. If so that would have made the access and posts by GS here easy since they were compromised else where.
MissA
05-12-2010, 12:49 PM
That's exactly untrue. Skunk's assessment was fine as far as it went. So what is it? 'Accept it as the final word or STFU?' That's what I'm seeing from you here.
Bullshit.
I said accept it or "do" something about it. Hire a white hat. I'm not being facetious. The only way the riddle will be solved is to hire an expert.
I said accept it or "do" something about it.Pay up or shut up? Wow- that's a clever tactic.
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 12:55 PM
Bullshit.
I said accept it or "do" something about it. Hire a white hat. I'm not being facetious. The only way the riddle will be solved is to hire an expert.
In that case...everything ever posted, anywhere, must be accepted on its face value. The bullshit on ATS, OMF, GLP.....even jedimillers goofy crap and IEF's stupid shit....just accept it as is or hire a private detective to find out the truth.
I think you're talking through your hat MissA.
BE knows if his passwords were the same across multiple web sites. If so that would have made the access and posts by GS here easy since they were compromised else where.They were not the same. I've already made that point.
MissA
05-12-2010, 12:58 PM
Pay up or shut up? Wow- that's a clever tactic.
Clever tactic? Boy you know how to misread someone to make a philosophical argument. Go find a free white hat then. I'm sure there are tons of them out there.
Does that make the argument better?
OK, BE, I missed that somewhere. There are ways to find passwords that are just much work.
The XSS exploit here would explain the redirect (what some termed rick-rolled).
Yeah- well I'm no student of programming esoterica. I'd love to see theories about the affair proposed in layman's terms. And of course that would inevitably dwell into areas of motive...
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 01:07 PM
Clever tactic? Boy you know how to misread someone to make a philosophical argument. Go find a free white hat then. I'm sure there are tons of them out there.
Does that make the argument better?
I read you the same way as BE did, actually. Strange that.
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:08 PM
Yeah- well I'm no student of programming esoterica. I'd love to see theories about the affair proposed in layman's terms. And of course that would inevitably dwell into areas of motive...
... that is, if anyone really cared.
The only thing compromised was your account, and that was done across three sites, two of which use inferior software to AmKon.
Go harass Chorlton and Doobie.
MissA
05-12-2010, 01:09 PM
In that case...everything ever posted, anywhere, must be accepted on its face value. The bullshit on ATS, OMF, GLP.....even jedimillers goofy crap and IEF's stupid shit....just accept it as is or hire a private detective to find out the truth.
I think you're talking through your hat MissA.
No, Mr Penny, I am not.
I am stating that the riddle cannot be solved though bitchery. It requires a subject matter expert.
I am stating that this site is a free site, so you get the sort of technical support that a free site can give you.
I am stating that no one forces anyone to post here, nor are dues required.
The fact that it angers people that I state the obvious is quite interesting. I am stating that this is my opinion. I am allowed to have one and to post it just as all of you are.
I am now having straw men built for me. I didn't say "STFU or get out", but it was stated that I did. I didn't say "STFU or pay", but it was stated that I did. I supplied endless options and my opinion that they would all be preferable to putting the onus on an already taxed Skunk.
I will adjourn as no one will address my actual arguments with anything other than an appeal to ridicule, begging the question(s), and red herrings.
MissA
05-12-2010, 01:10 PM
I read you the same way as BE did, actually. Strange that.
Not so strange at all, Trauma. I'd be surprised if it were otherwise. The only real difference between you and BE is that he would have "read" my posts, you feel that you can read me. BE isn't that presumptuous.
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 01:11 PM
I will adjourn as no one will address my actual arguments with anything other than an appeal to ridicule, begging the question(s), and red herrings.
Actually, people ARE adressing your arguments. And I see no attempt to ridicule you at all.
MissA
05-12-2010, 01:12 PM
Actually, people ARE adressing your arguments. And I see no attempt to ridicule you at all.
Of course you don't.
... that is, if anyone really cared.
The only thing compromised was your account, and that was done across three sites, two of which use inferior software to AmKon.
Go harass Chorlton and Doobie.
Actually, those weren't the only thing compromised.
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 01:18 PM
Actually, those weren't the only thing compromised.
What else happened?
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:19 PM
Actually, those weren't the only thing compromised.
The other "hack" was just scriptkiddie silliness and totally noninvasive.
I blame skunk.
No, Mr Penny, I am not.
I am stating that the riddle cannot be solved though bitchery. It requires a subject matter expert.
I am stating that this site is a free site, so you get the sort of technical support that a free site can give you.
I am stating that no one forces anyone to post here, nor are dues required.
The fact that it angers people that I state the obvious is quite interesting. I am stating that this is my opinion. I am allowed to have one and to post it just as all of you are.
I am now having straw men built for me. I didn't say "STFU or get out", but it was stated that I did. I didn't say "STFU or pay", but it was stated that I did. I supplied endless options and my opinion that they would all be preferable to putting the onus on an already taxed Skunk.
I will adjourn as no one will address my actual arguments with anything other than an appeal to ridicule, begging the question(s), and red herrings.
If this is what you meant, it was lost. You could have just said, "if you guys really want to know what happened here, you're going to have to hire a programmer to figure it out. Everything else is just mental masturbation ." Or, something along those lines.
Foxtrot Oscar
05-12-2010, 01:20 PM
There really isn't anything mental about it.
Fox
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 01:23 PM
Not so strange at all, Trauma. I'd be surprised if it were otherwise. The only real difference between you and BE is that he would have "read" my posts, you feel that you can read me. BE isn't that presumptuous.
Well, you claim (on what basis?) that I feel I can read you.... So, I can only conclude that YOU are able to read me, then? I find it very ironic that you use the word "presumptuous" about me, haha.
I was only adressing your words, what you have posted in this thread. And those words does in fact sound a lot like like a longer and more verbose version of "SHTU or get out." Or "Pay up or get out." And I am apparantly not the only one who gets that message from your posts. Perhaps that should tell you something.
There really isn't anything mental about it.
Fox
:D
So, that's what's obscuring my vision.
MissA
05-12-2010, 01:24 PM
If this is what you meant, it was lost. You could have just said, "if you guys really want to know what happened here, you're going to have to hire a programmer to figure it out. Everything else is just mental masturbation ." Or, something along those lines.
It wasn't all that I meant to say.
I meant also to say that this is a free site. You get the resolutions that you either pay for or bring yourself. It is like open source software. There is no technical support for that. You can't call a hotline.
I am also a bit frightened that the site owner will end up having to pay for stuff (financially or emotionally) when he/she is already taxed.
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 01:26 PM
I am also a bit frightened that the site owner will end up having to pay for stuff (financially or emotionally) when he/she is already taxed.
People DO actually donate to AmKon.
The account issue may not be something here. If it is a flaw in the forum then that flaw is in many sites and the word would be out.
Given HMs low traffic that site had a very good chance to look for and find unusual traffic.
MissA
05-12-2010, 01:28 PM
People DO actually donate to AmKon.
Yes, TT, I do know that. Not enough to cover the costs of new software or the cost of hiring an administrator to administer the site in the absence of Pack, nor to oversee security fortification, nor to fix bugs, nor to build spectacles like the arcade, nor to create plug ins, etc.
MissA
05-12-2010, 01:31 PM
And you forget that I also mentioned "emotionally taxed." Do you contribute to relieving the emotional burden of the site?
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:35 PM
http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w4/Shroedinger/Thread%20Pics/die_thread_die.jpg
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 01:35 PM
Yes, TT, I do know that. Not enough to cover the costs of new software or the cost of hiring an administrator to administer the site in the absence of Pack, nor to oversee security fortification, nor to fix bugs, nor to build spectacles like the arcade, nor to create plug ins, etc.
Well, I don't know how much other people donate, I only know what I have donated. I also don't know how much it costs to run a site like this.
We would need figures and facts to support your claim that the donations are not enough, wouldn't we?
I meant also to say that this is a free site. You get the resolutions that you either pay for or bring yourself. It is like open source software. There is no technical support for that. You can't call a hotline.To me, since this is occasionally a CT site, the hacker affair is proper subject matter. We discuss all sorts of things without the necessity (or benefit) of some sorts of experts. But I'd add that we do in fact have folks here with a modicum of coding/ site administration expertise- HP, Pack, Skunk, Chorlton, MrP and yourself for example. So it seems to me that this can be a productive discussion. If you're not up for it- well, that's fine. It can certainly proceed without your input.
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:37 PM
http://www.tokeofthetown.com/2010/03/18/tray_of_buds.jpeg
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 01:39 PM
http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w4/Shroedinger/Thread%20Pics/die_thread_die.jpg
LOL, shut up you fly-bitten fustilarian folly-fallen impertinent full-gorged clotpole.
God, I love Shakespeare!
:D
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:39 PM
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n150/FaTDaNHxC/marijuana_bud_pictures.jpg
MissA
05-12-2010, 01:40 PM
Well, I don't know how much other people donate, I only know what I have donated. I also don't know how much it costs to run a site like this.
We would need figures and facts to support your claim that the donations are not enough, wouldn't we?
Only if you lived in fantasy land where software developers charged $5 an hour to build websites.
You are still missing my point which is that there should be a nice "thank you" given alongside the "you need to do this...." when people put so much of their own time and money into a project.
If Pack wanted money for the work he did here he no doubt would have asked. He was an anarchist and chose not to take money for it.
Skunk and the other admins will have to find another "free" programmer, program it themselves, or pay someone. If the "free" route is the one given then I am back to: "thank yous are a good thing."
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:41 PM
http://www.lycaeum.org/~sputnik/Plants/Images/hangup.jpg
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 01:41 PM
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n150/FaTDaNHxC/marijuana_bud_pictures.jpg
Weird....I'm hungry. Wonder if there's any Doritos™ in the pantry?
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 01:42 PM
Nice.
http://www.lycaeum.org/%7Esputnik/Plants/Images/hangup.jpg
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:43 PM
http://media.katu.com/images/091123_Cannabis_Cafe.jpg
MissA
05-12-2010, 01:48 PM
To me, since this is occasionally a CT site, the hacker affair is proper subject matter. We discuss all sorts of things without the necessity (or benefit) of some sorts of experts. But I'd add that we do in fact have folks here with a modicum of coding/ site administration expertise- HP, Pack, Skunk, Chorlton, MrP and yourself for example. So it seems to me that this can be a productive discussion. If you're not up for it- well, that's fine. It can certainly proceed without your input.
I did not say that I would not help. I asked that we temper the lynching with a few "thank yous" for the beautiful site that was built through donated time.
My contribution to this is to remind people that hackers are more than software engineers. They are social engineers. They watch and wait. They do it for the fun of it. Watching everyone become paranoid is why they do what they do. The ones that will steal your bank account info don't let anyone know that they've hacked your account.
The ones that let you know they are doing it for what is essentially hacker "street cred", and/or the lulz.
If this were perpetrated by Pack, including the creation of a fake black hat, he could have done it without hacking into any system. He could have simply found a way around his own code to create a sock account without the sock trap catching it. He could have spread fear by culling from Facebook, MySpace, and past posts. Pack knows what scares all of us because he has been on this and other sites with us.
The fact that the hacking attempt was merely passwords and a few posts calling out Pack shows that this was most-likely not Pack because Pack actually spent hours covering up holes in the website that night. He would not do that to himself when he could fake that very same thing some other way.
Hackers are analysts. Reading our information, knowing who to send what to based on PMs, shows that this has been at least a few weeks in the making, not years. It was also only relegated towards people that were on HM when Pack was posting, not all of Pack's frenemies.
If it were Pack then it would have also involved a few others while he was at it.
As a linguistic expert I can tell you that the writing styles are different, as well in a subtle versus "faked" way.
Okay...did this help as far as analyzing and being "constructive"?
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:50 PM
Calling this a "hack" is like calling some spraypaint on your house "breaking and entering."
BE left a key under the mat or a window open and someone came in his house, drank his beer, watched his TV and left.
This is not hacking.
Reading through the thread again, I can say with certainty, the thread was dead pages ago until it was resurrected from the ashes for what reason - who knows?
Trauma Teased
05-12-2010, 01:55 PM
Reading through the thread again, I can say with certainty, the thread was dead pages ago until it was resurrected from the ashes for what reason - who knows?
Personally I was just bored.
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:55 PM
for what reason - who knows?
http://web.utk.edu/~jryel/GallawayAttentionWhore.jpg
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 01:55 PM
Personally I was just bored.
Hahah... that works, too.
:)
What's all that? A word from our sponsor?
Personally I was just bored.Well- me too. But then there was this:
I asked that we temper the lynching A lynching? Holy shit- who's bringing the popcorn?
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 02:27 PM
Screw the popcorn....who's got the tar and feathers?
Reading through the thread again, I can say with certainty, the thread was dead pages ago until it was resurrected from the ashes for what reason - who knows?
And that was Post 173? Resurrected this morning in Post 63. The Amkoidal Talmud is alive and well.
And it will not be finished until Foxtrot Oscar drives the final stake through it's evil heart...
Paroxysm
05-12-2010, 02:32 PM
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n150/FaTDaNHxC/marijuana_bud_pictures.jpg
+1
A+
Is this something you are growing? If not, do you know what strain that is?
..
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_OujkUUAn1ck/RkeCjEokXyI/AAAAAAAAACg/L-yFe0cu_jw/s320/kumar_weed1_1.jpg
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 02:40 PM
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_OujkUUAn1ck/RkeCjEokXyI/AAAAAAAAACg/L-yFe0cu_jw/s320/kumar_weed1_1.jpg
Former White House advisor.
Paroxysm
05-12-2010, 03:03 PM
He could have simply found a way around his own code to create a sock account without the sock trap catching it.
http://somecountryforoldmen.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/orly-ostrich.jpg
MissA
05-12-2010, 03:32 PM
Fake Pack has just presented us with another conundrum, hammering home my point that...we would need a real "white hat" to understand what really happened and who is to blame.
Does Pack have the capabilities to do all of this? Yes.
Did he? It would take a white hat to know.
Do we know any white hats that work for free? I know of none. I do know two but their hourly rates are $190 and up.
Do we know any grey hats that will work for free? Yes, the same guy everyone's accused.
So who is going to step up and get into the code? And who would trust them if they are doing it for free? Without it being a business and their business reputation being on the line...how could we trust someone with that much power?
It's a muddle.
Do we know any white hats that work for free?I trust HP's judgment on this. We all work for free here.
Oh- and it sure looks like BE2 also found a way around the sock trap with no particular effort or expertise. What the hell are you talking about?
MissA
05-12-2010, 03:40 PM
I trust HP's judgment on this. We all work for free here.
Pack used to work here for free, too.
So did Apeci, BK and Mojo. So? Ever hear of a labor of love?
Paroxysm
05-12-2010, 03:43 PM
WTF is all this shit about needing a "white hat" coding genius, to investigate some originating IP's, to read a few logs, and then add 2 + 2???
What do you think is contained in the site's source code which would be useful in investigating after an attack?
Has Skunk or Pack ever offered, even once, to let anybody else have free and open access to source code, logs, or the DB?
Sounds like you have jumped to possibly the wrong conclusion that:
A) You need an expensive "white hat" to read some logs.
and
B) That even if any of us were qualified to investigate (should we have admin access to the site, and full access to all logs), Skunk and/or pack would probably never allow for such a thing.
MissA
05-12-2010, 03:43 PM
Oh- and it sure looks like BE2 also found a way around the sock trap with no particular effort or expertise. What the hell are you talking about?
That Pack or whomever Social is they could have been on here for weeks without us knowing just looking and not posting, then posting as "social".
You know what...you guys have fun figuring it out. I'll talk about oil boycotts and esoteric stuff.
Good luck and contact Mr Penny. He has some good ideas.
oil boycotts are esoteric?
MissA
05-12-2010, 03:52 PM
WTF is all this shit about needing a "white hat" coding genius, to investigate some originating IP's, to read a few logs, and then add 2 + 2???
Because Parox it really isn't all that simple. What was allegedly done (if BE is 100% up and up) is a EDIT. Whoever it was will have covered their tracks pretty thoroughly.
What do you think is contained in the site's source code which would be useful in investigating after an attack?Holes.
Has Skunk or Pack ever offered, even once, to let anybody else have free and open access to source code, logs, or the DB?Why should they? "Anybody else" didn't build the site and there is such a thing as "bugs" when coders are careless, lazy, or just not good.
I would imagine they would want to "interview" people who are going to take up a job like that lest we end up bug-ridden.
Sounds like you have jumped to possibly the wrong conclusion that:
A) You need an expensive "white hat" to read some logs.No most of us can do that.
and
B) That even if any of us were qualified to investigate (should we have admin access to the site, and full access to all logs), Skunk and/or pack would probably never allow for such a thing.If Skunk doesn't allow for such a thing and his name is the responsible party then that is his prerogative. He doesn't have to do anything. He probably would, however, to a qualified person.
Were I Skunk I'd want to know what experience they had in Web 2.0, web maintenance, etc. I'd want to see what else they did because the site runs smoothly now.
When you are talking a EDIT then you want someone who is certified in these matters to make a call on this, someone who does this daily, etc.
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 03:55 PM
No one has been discussing this within the context of a Federal Offense.
What was allegedly done (if BE is 100% up and up) is a Federal Crime. hahahah ya think?
Paroxysm
05-12-2010, 03:59 PM
BE (and pack) prob had it coming though.
This is interesting. The portal says 25 and lists just 14.
25 members and 26 guests BE2 (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1579), Alessandra (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=811), egg (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1519)+, Eyeforalie (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1117), gottaknow (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1333), Hazelnut (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1461), hp (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=898), Infinite`Eternal`Forever (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1459), Jackinthebox (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=979), Jeddyhi (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1569), MissA (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1465), Paroxysm (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1470), Snow Crash (http://amkon.net/member.php?u=1164)
No one has been discussing this within the context of a Federal Offense.
Ummm... yeah.... good point.
This is interesting. The portal says 25 and lists just 14.
It's the same every day. Some members hide their names.
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 04:05 PM
Don't see me there do ya'?
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 04:06 PM
Limbozo?
Limbozo?
I'm happy to see that you didn't take his name in vain.
we are all but little plaints in the void
What became of the great Zamboni, anyway?
HE grew tired of us and moved on.... praise be.
Yeah. I was pretty much over the guy anyways.
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 04:10 PM
HE grew tired of us and moved on.... praise be.
Or did He?
Yeah. I was pretty much over the guy anyways.
That's fine. Just remember, he was over you first. HE never loses.
well there's certainly something to be said for that.
Or did He?
shouldn't that be accompanied by Twilight Zone music?
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 04:12 PM
shouldn't that be accompanied by Twilight Zone music?
Are you telling me you didn't hear it?
I guess I did...
Or, did you?
queue up the music again. jeeziz...
who the hell are you? Lamboozle??
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 04:21 PM
hohum........................
MissA
05-12-2010, 04:21 PM
I know that it has not been discussed in that context but this is why I am reluctant to stand back and weigh in on something that can do harm to someone that I know if he is innocent as he maintains.
He is absolutely 100% smart enough not to hack the system of someone he just openly fought with as he did with Chorlton. A man with two kids and a wife has a lot to lose. He is someone who has done equal measures of good for a lot of us, by helping us with side projects, making Amkon a pretty sweet site, etc.
He is also someone who while posting people's houses and pics, never broke the law in doing so. There is no precedent for EDIT: This. None.
What we are talking about is not data mining. It is also something that was done through system holes that he spent time fixing.
Yes, he could have hacked HM, RU, and Amkon, but personally I don't think he did because he's not stupid. It would be like threatening to shoot someone publicly, doing it the next day, and not expect to be a suspect.
Yes, some could argue that he did it precisely for that reason, but I don't buy it. It's been done in Basic Instinct and that's a movie, not RL.
I'm not saying that what he did to BE was good, but it isn't hacking EDIT. He is also someone who has a family that could be hurt badly by this were someone to set him up just for past beef.
If you ask me whether or not I think he "hacked" any of these sites, my answer is "no".
There is my two cents.
Noted. Let the record reflect this.
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 04:26 PM
"Patience, my son, for it is by waiting and watching ourselves that we learn how to be taught. And thou hast within thee the teachers who can impart the most, if thou wilt seek to hear them, yes, the professors who can teach thee more in a few minutes than others learn in a life."
Paroxysm
05-12-2010, 04:28 PM
I know that it has not been discussed in that context
851
You repeatedly made a point to discuss it in that context.
He is also someone who has a family that could be hurt badly by this were someone to set him up just for past beef.
Set him up for what? Hacking his blog? Where is this existential threat you sense?
MissA
05-12-2010, 04:33 PM
Okay...I don't want to make this any worse. I had no idea why people wanted to continue if the goal wasn't to see if the site was hacked or not.
I'll warren myself...
I'm going to knish myself. I've got a couple of knishes from the Knish Knosh on Queens Blvd in my fridge. They are potato-y goodness.
I had no idea why people wanted to continue if the goal wasn't to see if the site was hacked or not.That's the goal alright.
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 04:35 PM
I'm going to knish myself. I've got a couple of knishes from the Knish Knosh on Queens Blvd in my fridge. They are potato-y goodness.
Are knishes the same as pierogies?
depends on the neighborhood
Are knishes the same as pierogies?
Kinda. However, I've never had a knish like the ones from Knish Nosh. Not even remotely close.
http://knishnosh.com/
Cogburn
05-12-2010, 04:40 PM
Kinda. However, I've never had a knish like the ones from Knish Nosh. Not even remotely close.
http://knishnosh.com/
Oh man... hot potato knishes from the vendor half a block from Brighton Beach.
Homesick.
kishka. a shtikle for a nickle.
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 04:44 PM
I knever known a knish I've knot enkjoyed.
MissA
05-12-2010, 04:44 PM
knishes and pierogies are not the same at all except in deliciousness.
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 04:45 PM
I thought pierogies were a "dug out" type of canoe?
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 04:48 PM
I thought pierogies were a "dug out" type of canoe?
A dugout or dugout canoe is a boat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boat) which is basically a hollowed tree trunk. Other names for this type of boat are logboat and monoxylon. Monoxylon (μονόξυλον) (pl: monoxyla) is Greek -- mono- (single) + ξύλον (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%CE%BE%CF%8D%CE%BB%CE%BF%CE%BD) xylon (tree) -- and is mostly used in classic Greek texts. In Germany they are called Einbaum (English translation: One tree). Some, but not all, pirogues (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pirogue) are also constructed in this manner.
different spelling, but of course, you are correct.
fill em with mashed potatoes and they become knishes
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 04:52 PM
fill em with mashed potatoes and they become knishes buffets
Better™
MissA
05-12-2010, 04:53 PM
pierogies are like italian raviolis made from gnocchi dough and filled with: kapusta, cheese, cheese and potato, apricot, sauerkraut, etc.
they are boiled then fried in butter or butter and onions and served with sour cream.
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 04:54 PM
boiled then fried?
My frozen package does not say that.
MissA
05-12-2010, 04:55 PM
Pierogis (the best food in the world)
http://www.restaurantgirl.com/Pierogi_frying-1-thumb-350x233.jpg
http://pictures.polandforall.com/images/polish-pierogi-pierogies.jpg
Knish
http://www.bunrab.com/dailyfeed/dailyfeed_images_oct-06/df06_10-29_knish.jpg
you are thinking they are like piroshkis
http://www.sacherer.de/amerika/Anchorage/Anchorage_Piroshki.jpg
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 04:57 PM
Pierogis (the best food in the world)
I don't think so.......
MissA
05-12-2010, 04:57 PM
I don't think so.......
Wait until you've had my farmer cheese pierogis before you disagree.
Hazelnut
05-12-2010, 04:58 PM
you are thinking they are like piroshkis
http://www.sacherer.de/amerika/Anchorage/Anchorage_Piroshki.jpg
No! This is a Pasty (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasty).
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/bf/Cornish_pasty.jpeg/300px-Cornish_pasty.jpeg
MrPenny
05-12-2010, 04:59 PM
Fine, we'll trade....I'll offer up my gumbo and rice.
pack3tg0st
05-12-2010, 04:59 PM
MissA: There really is no point arguing with them... They're goi ngto see whatever the hell they want to see anyway.
As was stated, this is a CT site. No amount of actual evidence (or lack thereof) is going to convince anyone of anything.
I played this game with Chorlton too... he swore up and down that if I didn't do it, why didn't I deny it... so I did... and he responds saying he doesn't believe me.
The specific type of 'white hat' you're referring to is called a Computer Forensics Technician, I have no idea what they run these days, but there isn't going to be anything 'discovered' forensically. The Database wasn't touched... and even if it was, the guy was on TOR... which for all intents and purposes leaves everything untraceable. (there's a reason its the preferred anonymity network ya know).
So at this point... who the fuck cares if I'm a suspect? There's no way I can prove my innocence... but neither can MrP, HP, Cog or anyone else...
The difference being I get the distinct honor of being guilty until proven innocent.
fill em with mashed potatoes and they become knishes
Good for long trips down the river.