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skunk
04-30-2010, 05:47 PM
Study links drug enforcement to more violence (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5guOEw7_J3ArANWgM4t1QiLG_6jnAD9FB7R0G3)

Well, no shit! Prohibition is infinitely more harmful to society than outright legalization and regulation of drugs.

I'm glad this has finally made it to the mainstream.

The surge of gunbattles, beheadings and kidnappings that has accompanied Mexico's war on drug cartels is an entirely predictable escalation in violence based on decades of scientific literature, a new study contends.

A systematic review published Tuesday of more than 300 international studies dating back 20 years found that when police crack down on drug users and dealers, the result is almost always an increase in violence, say researchers at the International Centre for Science in Drug Policy (http://www.icsdp.org/docs/ICSDP-1%20-%20FINAL.pdf), a nonprofit group based in Britain and Canada.

When communities get tough on drug crime, that drives up the black market profits, prompting fierce battles to control the lucrative trade, their study says. And when powerful and successful drug bosses are taken out, it's all too common for more brutal and less sophisticated criminals to step in.

"Law enforcement is the biggest single expenditure on drugs, yet has rarely been evaluated. This work indicates an urgent need to shift resources from counterproductive law enforcement to a health-based public health approach," said Gerry Stimson, executive director of the International Harm Reduction Association which is hosting a conference this week in Liverpool, England, where the study was released.

As happened with Mexico's all-out drug crackdown launched when President Felipe Calderon took office a little over three years ago, murders shot up during the U.S. prohibition on liquor in the 1920s and during Colombia's crackdown on its drug gangs in the 1990s.

In 87 percent of the studies reviewed, intensifying drug law enforcement resulted in increased rates of drug market violence. Some of the studies included in the report said violence increases because power vacuums are created when police kill or arrest top drug traffickers. None showed a significant decrease in violence.

U.S. Drug Czar Gil Kerlikowske, asked about the findings, said the U.S. government is shifting its emphasis toward prevention and treatment of drug abuse, but he said the prohibition on drugs must remain and enforcement must continue.

"I don't know of any reason that legalizing something that essentially is bad for you would make it better, from a fiscal standpoint or a public health standpoint or a public safety standpoint," he said.

The former drug czar, John Walters, said the researchers gravely misinterpret drug violence. He said spikes of attacks and killings after law enforcement crackdowns are almost entirely between criminals, and therefore may, in a horrible, paradoxical way, reflect success.

"They're shooting each other, and the reason they're doing that is because they're getting weaker," he said.

Walters warned against blaming law enforcement.

"The cause of the violence is not the law. The cause of the violence is the criminals and the viciousness in which criminal activity is carried out," he said.

Calderon recognized when he became Mexico's president in December 2006 that smashing drug gangs was going to be costly.

"We are, at the end of the day, putting our lives on the line in this battle," he told The Associated Press soon after taking office.

Since then, Mexico has sent more than 45,000 soldiers into battle with cartels and seen an unprecedented wave of drug violence that has killed more than 22,700 people, most of them victims of disputes between rival gangs. But the dead also include police, soldiers, politicians and journalists as well as innocent civilians caught in shootouts.

As the toll rises, Calderon is coming under increasing criticism for his strategy. But a core constituency still applauds him.

"This government made a difficult but courageous decision to take on the cartels," said Luis de la Barreda, director of the Citizens' Institute for Crime Studies, an independent advocate for better security and accountability in law enforcement.

U.S. authorities have repeatedly emphasized their support for Mexico's drug interdiction efforts.

David Danelo, a senior fellow at the Foreign Policy Research Institute in Philadelphia, warned that authorities must guarantee the rule of law.

"If the police do not rule the streets, others will," he said.

skunk
04-30-2010, 05:50 PM
I have attached the report to this post.

If you would like to visit their website, click here (http://www.issdp.org/recentpublications.shtml).

From the PDF, page 22:

Conclusions

Based on the available English language scientific evidence, the results of this systematic review suggest that an increase in drug law enforce-ment interventions to disrupt drug markets is unlikely to reduce violence attributable to drug gangs. Instead, from an evidence-based public policy perspective and based on several decades of available data, the existing evidence strongly suggests that drug law enforcement contributes to gun violence and high homicide rates and that increasingly sophisticated methods of disrupt-ing organizations involved in drug distribution could unintentionally increase violence. In this context, and since drug prohibition has not achieved its stated goal of reducing drug supply, alternative models for drug control may need to be considered if drug-related violence is to be meaningfully reduced.

Bravo.

Jackinthebox
04-30-2010, 05:50 PM
I totally agree with you on this. You don't see liquor store owners out there shooting at eachother. And some drink is more likely to get you riled up than a doobies anyway.

skunk
04-30-2010, 05:54 PM
Not to mention drug dealers don't ask for identification. Children are more likely to have access to illicit drugs as a result.

If we regulate and control the distribution of drugs, we'll strip the cartels of their main source of profit, and reduce a good deal of violence in the long run.

MissA
04-30-2010, 05:56 PM
And not have to worry about budget deficits if they tax them like alcohol. Marijuana sales alone would put us in the black.

skunk
04-30-2010, 06:06 PM
Norml blog post about this study (http://blog.norml.org/2010/04/29/associated-press-study-links-drug-enforcement-to-more-violence/)

Just in case this recent CNN headline — “Government: More than 22,000 dead in Mexico drug war” (http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/04/14/government-more-than-22000-dead-in-mexico-drug-war/) — didn’t make this point crystal clear, we now have a scientific study (http://www.icsdp.org/research/publications.aspx) published by the good folks at International Centre for Science in Drug Policy to drive home the painfully obvious.

20,000 dead. For what? Drugs? For fucks sake.

Predictably, Drug Czar Gil Kerlikowske — like all prohibitionists — would rather stick his head in the sand than acknowledge the obvious.

When asked whether he believes that legalizing and regulating marijuana — the crop that, according to his own office, provides Mexican drug lords with over 60% of their present profits (http://www.thefreemanonline.org/featured/how-to-end-mexicos-deadly-drug-war/) — would in any way stave this ongoing violence, he responded (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5guOEw7_J3ArANWgM4t1QiLG_6jnAD9FB7R0G3): “I don’t know of any reason that legalizing something that essentially is bad for you would make it better, from a fiscal standpoint or a public health standpoint or a public safety standpoint.”

One plant provides 60% of the drug lords profits, and this douche doesn't want to legalize it? What is he smoking?

Let's regulate cocaine, heroin, and meth while we're at it too, and further cut the gangs profits.

Really? So does the Drug Czar favor outlawing alcohol, tobacco, red meat, trans-fats, soda, corn syrup, junk food, caffeine, sugar, and any one of thousands of other products and activities that are “essentially bad for you” too?

Make those drugs illegal too, they're dangerous.

And what about those 20,000+ dead since 2006 — many as a direct result of the United State’s prohibitionists policies? The Drug Czar doesn’t believe that staving such violence isn’t benefiting the public’s health? (Answer: You can’t make someone understand when it is in their job description not to (http://www.drugwarrant.com/articles/drug-czar-required/).)

Yes...It's the drug czar's job to lie about drugs. How interesting.

Sickeningly, ex-Drug Czar John Walters does Gil K. even one better — reiterating the notion (previously expressed (http://www.govexec.com/dailyfed/0409/041509kp1.htm) by pending DEA head Michelle Leonheart (https://secure2.convio.net/dpa/site/Advocacy?cmd=display&page=UserAction&id=532)) that the soaring violence and death south of the border is a sign that U.S. marijuana prohibition is working!

What? What? What?

Drug prohibition is working, yet violence increases? I thought it was supposed to work the other way around? You know, prohibition reducing crime and violence?

:facepalm:

According to the AP: “The former drug czar, John Walters, said the researchers gravely misinterpret drug violence. He said spikes of attacks and killings after law enforcement crackdowns are almost entirely between criminals, and therefore may, in a horrible, paradoxical way, reflect success. ‘They’re shooting each other, and the reason they’re doing that is because they’re getting weaker,’ he said.”

Right...Because drug cartels don't have an endless supply of soldiers at their disposal with billions of dollars to spend on protection.

Retard.

Yes, you read that right. In John Walters’ deluded mind, murder victims Lesley Enriquez (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2010/03/16/MN171CG7RA.DTL), — who worked at the U.S. Consulate and was four months pregnant — and her husband must have been ‘criminals,’ and the rising death toll on the U.S./Mexico border is obviously a human billboard of our success!

It’s now apparent that only a fool — or someone who is paid to act like one — would fail to see that it is time to remove the production and distribution of marijuana out of the hands of violent criminal enterprises and into the hands of licensed businesses (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-armentano/are-us-pot-laws-the-root_b_502988.html). Of course, the only way to do that is through legalization — yet this is a policy that, tragically, remains devoid from the Drug Czar’s, and the President’s, vocabulary (http://www.komonews.com/news/local/52676987.html).

Jackinthebox
04-30-2010, 06:08 PM
And not have to worry about budget deficits if they tax them like alcohol. Marijuana sales alone would put us in the black.

I could be wrong here, but it seems to me that the projected revenue in NY state from marijuana taxation MATCHED our current, considerably large, defecit. I would totally open up a bud shop too and not have to worry about work.

skunk
04-30-2010, 06:09 PM
U.S. Laws Root Cause of Drug Violence?

f_uBYIyhTGk

7:46 minute long video about the drug war.

Jackinthebox
04-30-2010, 06:12 PM
And let me throw this jab out there. If drugs were legalized, we wouldn't have anywhere near the problems with illegal immigration that we have today. Not only would there be a lot less people trying to get into the country, but they would be of a higher caliber of person as well.

MrPenny
04-30-2010, 06:23 PM
Great, a pile of money spent to arrive at a conclusion that most clear-headed thinkers have held for some time. Money poorly spent.....considering that they could have studied the history of Prohibition and realized a shortcut.

egg
04-30-2010, 06:26 PM
I could be wrong here, but it seems to me that the projected revenue in NY state from marijuana taxation MATCHED our current, considerably large, defecit. I would totally open up a bud shop too and not have to worry about work.

Word.

MrPenny
04-30-2010, 06:27 PM
Two word.

skunk
04-30-2010, 06:41 PM
Great, a pile of money spent to arrive at a conclusion that most clear-headed thinkers have held for some time. Money poorly spent.....considering that they could have studied the history of Prohibition and realized a shortcut.

Two words. Alcohol prohibition.

Cogburn
04-30-2010, 08:03 PM
And let me throw this jab out there. If drugs were legalized, we wouldn't have anywhere near the problems with illegal immigration the CIA manufactured drug cartels that we have today. Not only would there be a lot less people trying to get into the country, but they would be of a higher caliber of person as well.

Fixed.

Snow Crash
04-30-2010, 08:39 PM
Good article skunk

MissA
04-30-2010, 08:42 PM
The question is: what to do about it? Clearly legalization has its benefits (crops grown within the US, taxes, lowers crime), and there are supporters (Ron Paul)...what do we do?

MrPenny
04-30-2010, 08:43 PM
I think everyone that cares...should begin openly using marijuana.....flood the system.

egg
04-30-2010, 08:43 PM
The question is: what to do about it? Clearly legalization has its benefits (crops grown within the US, taxes, lowers crime), and there are supporters (Ron Paul)...what do we do?

Vote in people who have the balls to do something about it? Oh, they're too few. Then, nothing, I guess.

MissA
04-30-2010, 08:44 PM
I think everyone that cares...should begin openly using marijuana.....flood the system.

True. I think dropping out and civil disobedience needs to become more mainstream.

Jackinthebox
04-30-2010, 08:48 PM
I think everyone that cares...should begin openly using marijuana.....flood the system.

I used to do that. And I still would in fact. BUt I really just can't deal with the high anymore. Well, and of course, there are job issues and stuff. But aside from all that, I just really can't deal with the puff puff anymore. I puffed heavy for years, but it turned on me toward the end, and I just really don't enjoy it all anymore.

egg
04-30-2010, 08:49 PM
I used to do that. And I still would in fact. BUt I really just can't deal with the high anymore. Well, and of course, there are job issues and stuff. But aside from all that, I just really can't deal with the puff puff anymore. I puffed heavy for years, but it turned on me toward the end, and I just really don't enjoy it all anymore.

I understand that.

Ima Nasshole
04-30-2010, 08:49 PM
If we dropped to a 4 day work week and legalized pot, we'd have fewer people in prison, more revenue in the coffers, and we'd reduce our dependence on foreign oil. Now the price of Dorito's and condoms might go through the roof, but hey...

MissA
04-30-2010, 08:50 PM
Amen.

egg
04-30-2010, 08:51 PM
If we dropped to a 4 day work week and legalized pot, we'd have fewer people in prison, more revenue in the coffers, and we'd reduce our dependence on foreign oil. Now the price of Dorito's and condoms might go through the roof, but hey...

Make it so, Nasshole.

Cogburn
04-30-2010, 08:52 PM
If we dropped to a 4 day work week and legalized pot, we'd have fewer people in prison, more revenue in the coffers, and we'd reduce our dependence on foreign oil. Now the price of Dorito's and condoms might go through the roof, but hey...

If you set those as personal goals and work towards them every day, you've already won.

MrPenny
04-30-2010, 08:55 PM
I am currently on a 4 day work week...and I passed the urine test....sweet!

I'm a fuckin' winner!!!!!

Ima Nasshole
04-30-2010, 09:04 PM
I am currently on a 4 day work week...and I passed the urine test....sweet!

I'm a fuckin' winner!!!!!
Dude, you gotta job? Way to go! Good on ya mate!

Jackinthebox
04-30-2010, 09:13 PM
Marlbuds

http://208.106.153.228/uploads/114/5.jpg

Prometheus
04-30-2010, 09:15 PM
Jack you gaddam illegal! Caught you!

Jackinthebox
04-30-2010, 09:17 PM
Jack you gaddam illegal! Caught you!

:rock:

MrPenny
04-30-2010, 09:33 PM
Dude, you gotta job? Way to go! Good on ya mate!


Even better...I'm a college instructor.....teh stoodentz is fukked!!!!

MissA
04-30-2010, 10:31 PM
I think I am going to start a shitter account just for this topic and sheet the hell out of it.

skunk
05-01-2010, 11:44 AM
The question is: what to do about it? Clearly legalization has its benefits (crops grown within the US, taxes, lowers crime), and there are supporters (Ron Paul)...what do we do?

Spread the word about prohibitionists, vote for people who understand what needs to be done, fuck it, run for office yourself. I'm not quite old enough yet, and I still need that college degree to be taken seriously.

I like the idea of civil disobedience, but make sure its nonviolent. Violence seems to drive people the other way.

MissA
05-01-2010, 11:47 AM
Spread the word about prohibitionists, vote for people who understand what needs to be done, fuck it, run for office yourself. I'm not quite old enough yet, and I still need that college degree to be taken seriously.

I like the idea of civil disobedience, but make sure its nonviolent. Violence seems to drive people the other way.

Well, Skunk...people don't really trust people with my accent so the best I can do is online stuff and maybe fund raising.

But I'm going to do it. If we had a working folder of all this information we could all make a pledge to retweet, DIGG, etc.

skunk
05-01-2010, 11:50 AM
War and Peace has a ton of well-sourced material. All you have to do is look.

MissA
05-01-2010, 12:42 PM
Ron Paul is probably the only popular member of Congress to take up the mantle.

ufekh_SwZd0

skunk
05-01-2010, 12:48 PM
Kucinich doesn't seem too bad (http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/Dennis_Kucinich_Drugs.htm)