View Full Version : A new forum launched
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 08:42 AM
Miss A and Tracer are now online with their news forum. Twenty members and growing fast. It's definitely a serious venture- uncluttered, free and open. I'd strongly urge all of our members to visit and join and contribute. It's a perfect companion to Amkon. I intend to spend lots of time there as lkwalker- (and maybe a few other cartoon characters.) Here it is:
http://www.altnewsviews.com/forum/index.php
I'm to scared to look . . . :D
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 09:12 AM
hahahahah you're gonna love it. just get yer skinny ass over there.
MissA
12-22-2009, 09:26 AM
Thank you boycott. Tracer did the whole thing in ... a week? Can't remember. Whenever the last big blowup was. Anyway, the kid is a coding machine. We are definitely going to try to keep the right "spirit"... Here is a question, we want to get the front end to be news. We're taking the news and trying to remove the propaganda (hence why the articles end up being two sentences)...how do we get people to read it versus only hit the forums? I'm open to suggestions.
Trauma Teased
12-22-2009, 09:36 AM
Thank you boycott. Tracer did the whole thing in ... a week? Can't remember. Whenever the last big blowup was. Anyway, the kid is a coding machine. We are definitely going to try to keep the right "spirit"... Here is a question, we want to get the front end to be news. We're taking the news and trying to remove the propaganda (hence why the articles end up being two sentences)...how do we get people to read it versus only hit the forums? I'm open to suggestions.
I wish you good luck with the new forum. Have taken a brief look already, the site looks nice.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 09:40 AM
Thank you boycott. Tracer did the whole thing in ... a week? Can't remember. Whenever the last big blowup was. Anyway, the kid is a coding machine. We are definitely going to try to keep the right "spirit"... Here is a question, we want to get the front end to be news. We're taking the news and trying to remove the propaganda (hence why the articles end up being two sentences)...how do we get people to read it versus only hit the forums? I'm open to suggestions.
Links to news sites would be better than a compendium I think. I suggest www.antiwar.com as a good place to start.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 09:42 AM
another one: http://english.aljazeera.net/
MissA
12-22-2009, 09:47 AM
Thanks! We're trying to get a TASS feed (Tracer's scrambling) and some of the others. I'll tell him about those. He's coding his fingers to the bone and STILL has time to argue with the Zuzz. Also, another question (I also posted it over there) where do we get "good" UFO stuff?
we want to get the front end to be news. We're taking the news and trying to remove the propaganda (hence why the articles end up being two sentences)
yikes...
Jackinthebox
12-22-2009, 09:56 AM
No.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 09:59 AM
Thanks! We're trying to get a TASS feed (Tracer's scrambling) and some of the others. I'll tell him about those. He's coding his fingers to the bone and STILL has time to argue with the Zuzz. Also, another question (I also posted it over there) where do we get "good" UFO stuff?You can mine this site for links. This guy is on it bigtime! http://keyholepublishing.com/
So, no original article and an op-ed piece from your end. Just partial quote ot the original and no link back?
TracerBullet
12-22-2009, 10:19 AM
Some of the stuff is like that at the moment but this will be replaced by new articles soon. We just wanted to go live asap with content so people could have a look.
Its kinda hard for two of you to write entire articles for every section and still keep it current.
More exclusives and new articles are on the way.
MissA
12-22-2009, 10:24 AM
I can't remember but I think I wrote all the front end from scratch...hence why so short. When you drill out commentary the articles--er, news part of it, the facts end up being two sentences long. Which, maybe, is really what we need?
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 10:29 AM
There are no 'facts' in news...
MissA
12-22-2009, 10:30 AM
Well, saying: 40 people died in the blast is a fact, yes?
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:32 AM
yes
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:34 AM
but why not simply link to the article and allow for comments that link directly to the forum for further discussion?
MissA
12-22-2009, 10:34 AM
Literally I went through articles and realized that people put so much filler in them, and that filler contributes to how you "feel" about the story. It was an interesting exercise to "take it out" and get to the "facts". You realize that there are maybe only 2 "facts" in an entire article and the rest is filler.
just seems only displaying that parts you agree with isn't necessarily honest reporting of soneone's article. Basically partially quoting the original.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:35 AM
Literally I went through articles and realized that people put so much filler in them, and that filler contributes to how you "feel" about the story. It was an interesting exercise to "take it out" and get to the "facts". You realize that there are maybe only 2 "facts" in an entire article and the rest is filler.that 'distillation' should be the job of the forum discussion.
MissA
12-22-2009, 10:35 AM
but why not simply link to the article and allow for comments that link directly to the forum for further discussion?
*scratches head*
My brain is fried, but I think we were attempting something bigger than we could handle at the time and that was to report real news.
Probably not a good idea...:confused:
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 10:35 AM
Well, saying: 40 people died in the blast is a fact, yes?
Sort of
What about the omission of other facts that paint the picture...
all suited to slant an agenda...
All news is opinion in one way or another.
Maybe bold the 'facts' as you see them.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 10:37 AM
Maybe bold the 'facts' as you see them.
*emphasis mine (obviously)
HP gets it :)
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:37 AM
All news is opinion in one way or another. that's exacly why we have discussion forums, no?
Aren't you opening the door to original authors getting upset with your site and DMCA (Bill'ed hehe)
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:38 AM
Maybe bold the 'facts' as you see them.
but who can know which facts are accurate?
Right, But show the 'facts' you believe true. People can judge for them self.
TracerBullet
12-22-2009, 10:41 AM
but why not simply link to the article and allow for comments that link directly to the forum for further discussion?
This is in the works. :)
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:41 AM
This is in the works. :)excellent!
MissA
12-22-2009, 10:42 AM
Hey! Thanks everyone for helping since you certainly don't have to.
Considering that we are getting the "facts" from multiple sources I don't think we can get DMCA'd...BUT...it is a shitter trying to hedge them out.
Getting multiple "news" feeds it probably better--no, easier. *sigh*
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 10:42 AM
that's exacly why we have discussion forums, no?
I'm coming to believe that discussion can't really reveal 'truth' due to the varying degrees of exposure to propaganda. But thats an opinion...
anyway...
Truth is relative.
Which is why you have to find it for yourself, instead of reading someone else's realtive truths through news releases.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 10:42 AM
Hey! Thanks everyone for helping since you certainly don't have to.
Considering that we are getting the "facts" from multiple sources I don't think we can get DMCA'd...BUT...it is a shitter trying to hedge them out.
Getting multiple "news" feeds it probably better--no, easier. *sigh*
You can't get DMCA'd if you provide proper attribution...
Just a hint :)
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:44 AM
I'm coming to believe that discussion can't really reveal 'truth' due to the varying degrees of exposure to propaganda. But thats an opinion...
anyway...
Truth is relative.
Which is why you have to find it for yourself, instead of reading someone else's realtive truths through news releases.that truth is relative is a given. that discussion is a method of approaching truth is also a given.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 10:44 AM
but who can know which facts are accurate?
Hey!
I think BE gets it now :-)
MissA
12-22-2009, 10:44 AM
Pack, this is true...BUT...perhaps everyone should pour through the various news articles just once to "write" the facts. It is an interesting exercise.
Q: If I read 10 different news sites to glean the "facts" then I would theoretically say: I read X, Y, Z and here is what I got?
Serious Q...
MissA
12-22-2009, 10:45 AM
"Truth" is philosophy. "Facts" are not. 50 people died in _____ blast is a fact. Their reasoning, the "story" is someone's "truth"
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:46 AM
Hey!
I think BE gets it now :-)what? you think you've made some sort of discovery? every point of view results in a different aperception of 'fact.'
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:49 AM
as a matter of fact- this discussion belongs on the Trace and Rinnie Show. Hopefully it will be linked or mirrored there.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 10:50 AM
that truth is relative is a given. that discussion is a method of approaching truth is also a given.
To find out what actually happened a half a world away, you have to rely on the relative truths of the people who were there...
Discussion is a method of debating which of those truths we should accept as a group...
Any 'truth' revealed would be an opinion based on which relative truth we think we should discount or believe...
Figuring it out in a group can breed groupthink...
This is pack3tg0st pre-coffee... so straight from brain to keyboard... who knows if its coherent....
You can't get DMCA'd if you provide proper attribution...
Just a hint :)
That's what I was pointing out. Better to build a record with attribution.
I might actually visit since I have been signed up for 12 hours and am still unbanned.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 10:55 AM
Pack, this is true...BUT...perhaps everyone should pour through the various news articles just once to "write" the facts. It is an interesting exercise.
Q: If I read 10 different news sites to glean the "facts" then I would theoretically say: I read X, Y, Z and here is what I got?
Serious Q...
Thats why I gave up trying to figure out the 'news'... and instead focus on the bias, slant, and propaganda techniques that support it...
absolutely everything you see, read or hear that's news has been written to benefit some group in the wealthy elite class... Thus, Chomsky and Herman's Propaganda Model...
If you read 10 different news sites to try and separate the wheat from the chaff, discovering the actual facts of the event are not a certanty.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:56 AM
Discussion is a method of debating which of those truths we should accept as a group...accept nothing. discussion is always an ongoing process. process has no end point wherein the 'group' has set truth in stone.
TracerBullet
12-22-2009, 10:58 AM
Thats why I gave up trying to figure out the 'news'... and instead focus on the bias, slant, and propaganda techniques that support it...
absolutely everything you see, read or hear that's news has been written to benefit some group in the wealthy elite class... Thus, Chomsky and Herman's Propaganda Model...
If you read 10 different news sites to try and separate the wheat from the chaff, discovering the actual facts of the event are not a certanty.
I agree completely is it futile to try though? Even slightly more accurate is better than nothing?
I understand what your saying Pack, I think its worth a shot though. If it don't work out, It don't.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 10:58 AM
absolutely everything you see, read or hear that's news has been written to benefit some group in the wealthy elite class... Thus, Chomsky and Herman's Propaganda Model...that is total bullshit and a misunderstanding of Chomsky. as alexander pope said- 'a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.'
skunk
12-22-2009, 11:00 AM
Chomsky is a toolbox.
All news has propaganda, slant, and opinion in it, otherwise it wouldn't be news.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:01 AM
Chomsky is a toolbox linguist. fixt
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 11:02 AM
that is total bullshit and a misunderstanding of Chomsky. as alexander pope said- 'a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.'
No its not BE... The propaganda model states that 'news' has to pass through the five filters of the model before it's publication... Since they're getting their news from mainstream publication sources, we can bet that its passed through the second (and third) filter already...
Me stating that all news will benefit one group or another of the wealthy elite is damn close to an original quote from Chomsky in the book 'Understanding Power'.
I'd pull out the book and quote it verbatim for you, but right now my brother is borrowing it...
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:03 AM
I agree completely is it futile to try though? No. By no means- no. Keep trying- it's what inquiring minds are constrained to do.
skunk
12-22-2009, 11:03 AM
The funny part about Chomsky is that he decries the elite establishment, the very organization he is a part of.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 11:06 AM
The funny part about Chomsky is that he decries the elite establishment, the very organization he is a part of.
Yes... that is true... but that tends to happen to well educated individuals...
But, his money comes from his background as a linguist... he's written over 100 books... and has a huge hand in where linguistics are today...
skunk
12-22-2009, 11:07 AM
That fact alone should raise serious concerns about the man and HIS agenda. Look at who funds him.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:07 AM
The funny part about Chomsky is that he decries the elite establishment, the very organization he is a part of. i guess we should all just kill ourselves then, eh?- since we're all 'part' of it in one way or another...
That depends on how much bias a buck buys.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 11:09 AM
I agree completely is it futile to try though? Even slightly more accurate is better than nothing?
I think this is where BE and I disagree in a big way....
Is it futile to try where failure is a certainty?
thats going to be something thats up to the individual... god knows I do shit thats destined to fail every day...
You'll never find the truth... and if you did, you'd have no way of knowing if it was indeed truth or not...
like I said... thats why I gave up trying to decipher the bullshit in the news... and now just stick to figuring out why its spun a certain way....
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 11:10 AM
That fact alone should raise serious concerns about the man and HIS agenda. Look at who funds him.
MIT?
and the people who buy his books?
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:10 AM
Look at who funds him. Pack and i fund him by buying his books.
Paroxysm
12-22-2009, 11:11 AM
Chomsky is a toolbox linguist gatekeeper.
fixt
Fixt!
Foxtrot Oscar
12-22-2009, 11:12 AM
I'll give it a few weeks and let the cream settle or the shit sink...
Time (as ever) will tell.
Fox
TracerBullet
12-22-2009, 11:13 AM
I think this is where BE and I disagree in a big way....
Is it futile to try where failure is a certainty?
thats going to be something thats up to the individual... god knows I do shit thats destined to fail every day...
You'll never find the truth... and if you did, you'd have no way of knowing if it was indeed truth or not...
like I said... thats why I gave up trying to decipher the bullshit in the news... and now just stick to figuring out why its spun a certain way....
Maybe your right Pack. None the less I intend to keep trying until I feel it is futile myself. Its all a learning curve right?
Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible. — Lord Kelvin, 1892
If we had taken his word for it what would that have done for us?
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:14 AM
You'll never find the truthand so? It's the approach that's important- not the result. human enquiry is important in itself.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:17 AM
Is it futile to try where failure is a certainty? maybe you should give up your japanese cartoons and pick up Plato.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 11:17 AM
and so? It's the approach that's important- not the result. human enquiry is important in itself.
hehe that is certainly the philosophical answer...
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 11:18 AM
maybe you should give up your japanese cartoons and pick up Plato.
japanese cartoons?
huh?
perhaps you have me mistaken for someone else...
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:19 AM
I'll give it a few weeks and let the cream settle or the shit sink...
Time (as ever) will tell.
Foxfuck it. let's help built it. they have a good point of departure.
skunk
12-22-2009, 11:19 AM
Hoaxmasters 2.0?
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:19 AM
japanese cartoons?
huh?
perhaps you have me mistaken for someone else...oh yeah. sorry. that was Cockporn.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:20 AM
Hoaxmasters 2.0?they're doing it better than we did- and are more committed.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:21 AM
but the aims are the same
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 11:22 AM
fuck it. let's help built it. they have a good point of departure.
I've registered over there already...
I just don't know how much time I'll have to be able to contribute...
You fuckers over here keep me pretty busy...
Then there's the technical forums I belong to....
MissA
12-22-2009, 11:23 AM
I might actually visit since I have been signed up for 12 hours and am still unbanned.
Well we would appreciate it and we aren't the banning type. If I could I would post Tracer's lovely post on just that very topic. We like to debate and argue. Tracer's British and I'm part Polish-part Russian, so i was born from conflict.
MissA
12-22-2009, 11:24 AM
BE, we don't want to duplicate what you guys do here so if we "start" we will link back to here and continue discussion here. We don't want to be "tossers".
Well we would appreciate it and we aren't the banning type. If I could I would post Tracer's lovely post on just that very topic. We like to debate and argue. Tracer's British and I'm part Polish-part Russian, so i was born from conflict.
I have a bit of Ukraine in my linage.
boycotteverything
12-22-2009, 11:26 AM
BE, we don't want to duplicate what you guys do here so if we "start" we will link back to here and continue discussion here. We don't want to be "tossers".as soon as the folks here are more comfortable with your format that discussion will take place there. but a little bleed-over isn't a bad thing on the eternal unithread.
pack3tg0st
12-22-2009, 11:29 AM
Don't get me wrong RA hahaha
I'm not hammering you guys...
I'm hammering News in general :)
Lexion
12-22-2009, 11:40 AM
just seems only displaying that parts you agree with isn't necessarily honest reporting of soneone's article. Basically partially quoting the original.
I happen to agree with HP.
This will inevitably lead to
your slant/opinion on the
article.
The bolding/emphasis mine while
including the whole article seems
the way to go.
Plus, as pointed out, the original
authors might get pissed.
TracerBullet
12-22-2009, 12:11 PM
I happen to agree with HP.
This will inevitably lead to
your slant/opinion on the
article.
The bolding/emphasis mine while
including the whole article seems
the way to go.
Plus, as pointed out, the original
authors might get pissed.
Cool, sounds good with me. Link backs will be included with all none exclusive material. :thumright: