View Full Version : Infragard and ATS
Hey ATS guests, here's a good topic, a real money maker, for you to post at that site.
Ask about ATS and whether they participate in Infragard. All the discussion with nay saying about the FBI monitoring that site has gone in circles for years. Well, may be the FBI doesn't need to monitor. They have enlisted the site into Infragard and have the staff do it for them. Quite a convenient way to accomplish the task.
Another set of private sector eyes and ears for big brother.
Cogburn
05-25-2009, 05:33 PM
*snicker*
GhostOfCaptSpaulding
05-25-2009, 05:48 PM
But to be a member of Infraguard wouldn't sohai have to sponsor "critical infrastructure?"
The only "critical infrastructure" I see them supporting is Swill and Thinger's bank accounts.
Oh, and fostering the puerile and naive in their walled and carefully monitored lucre generating garden.
Captain, check the WITD 2 thread.
GhostOfCaptSpaulding
05-25-2009, 06:14 PM
Damn, I've been gone awhile...linky?
skunk
05-25-2009, 09:54 PM
This isn't what you're looking for goos (check the sooper sekret forum), but it goes with the thread:
InfraGard: The FBI Deputizes Business (http://www.projectcensored.org/top-stories/articles/3-infragard-the-fbi-deputizes-business/)
More than 23,000 representatives of private industry are working quietly with the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) to collect and provide information on fellow Americans. In return, members of this rapidly growing group, called InfraGard, receive secret warnings of terrorist threats before the public, and at times before elected officials. “There is evidence that InfraGard may be closer to a corporate Total Information Awareness program (TIPS), turning private-sector corporations—some of which may be in a position to observe the activities of millions of individual customers—into surrogate eyes and ears for the FBI,” according to an ACLU report titled “The Surveillance-Industrial Complex: How the American Government Is Conscripting Businesses and Individuals in the Construction of a Surveillance Society.”
InfraGard, with members from 350 companies of the Fortune 500, started in Cleveland back in 1996, when the private sector there cooperated with the FBI to investigate cyber threats. “Then the FBI cloned it,” says Phyllis Schneck, chairman of the board of directors of the InfraGard National Members Alliance, and the prime mover behind the growth of InfraGard over the last several years.
FBI Director Robert Mueller addressed an InfraGard convention on August 9, 2005. “To date, there are more than 11,000 members of InfraGard . . . from our perspective, that amounts to 11,000 contacts . . . and 11,000 partners in our mission to protect America.” He added a little later, “Those of you in the private sector are the first line of defense.”
On May 9, 2007, George Bush issued National Security Presidential Directive 51 entitled “National Continuity Policy.” In it, he instructed the Secretary of Homeland Security to coordinate with “private sector owners and operators of critical infrastructure, as appropriate, in order to provide for the delivery of essential services during an emergency.”
“They’re very much looped into our readiness capability,” says Amy Kudwa, spokeswoman for the DHS. “We provide speakers, as well as joint presentations [with the FBI]. We also train alongside them, and they have participated, sometimes hundreds at a time, in national preparation drills.” According to more than one interviewed member, an additional benefit to InfraGard membership is permission to shoot to kill in the event of martial law, without fear of prosecution.
“We get very easy access to secure information that only goes to InfraGard members,” Schneck says. “If you had to call 1-800-FBI, you probably wouldn’t bother,” she says. “But if you knew Joe from the local meeting you had with him over a donut, you might call. Either to give or to get [information]. We want everyone to have a little black book.”
Jay Stanley, public education director of the ACLU’s technology and liberty program, warns that, “The FBI should not be creating a privileged class of Americans who get special treatment. There’s no ‘business class’ in law enforcement. If there’s information the FBI can share with 22,000 corporate bigwigs, why don’t they just share it with the public? That’s who their real ‘special relationship’ is supposed to be with. Secrecy is not a party favor to be given out to friends. . . . This bears a disturbing resemblance to the FBI’s handing out ‘goodies’ to corporations in return for folding them into its domestic surveillance machinery.”
InfraGard is not readily accessible to the general public. Its communications with the FBI and DHS are beyond the reach of the Freedom of Information Act under the “trade secrets” exemption, its website says. And any conversation with the public or the media is to be carefully rehearsed.
UPDATE BY MATT ROTHSCHILD
The Progressive sent out a press release on the InfraGard story, and I was interviewed on Air America, Democracy Now! and lots of other alternative radio shows. But the mainstream media have ignored this story, with the exception of one small wire service report. The FBI hasn’t ignored it, though.
On February 15, the FBI issued a press release denouncing our article.
“The article’s claims are patently false,” said the FBI’s Cyber Division Assistant Director Shawn Henry. “InfraGard members have no extraordinary powers and have no greater right to ‘shoot to kill’ than other civilians.”
“No greater right”? That’s odd language, isn’t it? It reminded me of a quote in my article from Curt Haugen, CEO of S’Curo Group, and a proud InfraGard member. When I asked him about whether the FBI or Homeland Security agents had told InfraGard members they could use lethal force in an emergency, he said: “That much I cannot comment on. But as a private citizen, you have the right to use force if you feel threatened.”
Note that the FBI did not deny that it ever told InfraGard members that they could “shoot to kill.” All that Henry said was that InfraGard members “have no greater right.” That doesn’t exactly blow a hole in my story.
The FBI seemed put out that I did not give enough information about the meeting the whistleblower attended. “Unfortunately, the author of the Progressive article refused even to identify when or where the claimed ‘small meeting’ occurred in which issues of martial law were discussed,” Henry said in the press release. “If we get that information, the FBI certainly will follow up and clarify any possible misunderstandings.”
The reason I didn’t identify where or when the meeting took place is obvious: I didn’t want to reveal anything that would expose my whistleblower.
Incidentally, the press release fails to mention that I received confirmation about discussions of “lethal force” from another member of InfraGard, whom I did name.
I stick by every single word of my story. And I call on Congress to investigate InfraGard and to inspect the plans that the FBI may have in store, not only for InfraGard, but for all of us in times of an emergency.
One final note: since the story appeared, I’ve received several new leads, including one confirming that a private company has been given “lethal powers.”
Cogburn
05-25-2009, 10:33 PM
ROFL TIN FOIL WARNING!!!!111one
[spoiler:5yofdcu0]
UPDATE BY MATT ROTHSCHILD
Sorry... Couldn't resist. :)[/spoiler:5yofdcu0]
Let's throw in the phase 'by their own admission'.
skunk
05-25-2009, 10:36 PM
Matthew Rothschild (http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=8040) is the editor of The Progressive magazine and the author of "You Have No Rights: Stories of America in an Age of Repression."
He may be part of the same banking family, but that doesn't make him a bad guy does it?
Cogburn
05-25-2009, 10:42 PM
[offsite:30jrny33]Matthew Rothschild (http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=8040) is the editor of The Progressive magazine and the author of "You Have No Rights: Stories of America in an Age of Repression."[/offsite:30jrny33]
He may be part of the same banking family, but that doesn't make him a bad guy does it?
Nah just making a little CT humor...
I'm of the opinion that Sir Evelyn is actually more of a friend to the "common man" than most folks might think...
Bitchkoma
05-26-2009, 01:21 AM
DUN DUN DUNNN
GeneralStriker
05-26-2009, 01:30 AM
He may be part of the same banking family, but that doesn't make him a bad guy does it?hahahahaha!
not just infragard either, TRUSTe and their in-q-tel connections are enough to raise flags with me, it seems ats are aligned with a number of conspiracy theorists wet dreams. :pound:
Cogburn
05-26-2009, 03:12 AM
ROFL... that's assuming that you still are deluded enough to believe that a TRUSTe banner means something.
Although given Bill Irvine is a self-styled online community marketing genius I guess he might be just so deluded... or not be informed enough to care.
Real men use OpenID.
Real men use OpenID.
As if this makes any real difference in the big picture.
Real men use OpenID.
As if this makes any real difference in the big picture.
yup...bbn tech and in-q-tel have their hands in enough tech firms now that its almost guaranteed they have ways and means around any "privacy" you think you might have.
Real men just take their chances with the internet. there is no such thing as a security blanket out here,
Cogburn
05-26-2009, 02:15 PM
Real men just take their chances with the internet. there is no such thing as a security blanket out here,
C'mon now... do you drag your credit cards behind you on the ground when you walk?
[insert here joke about how lame chain wallets are]
No.. you put them in a wallet and put the wallet in your pocket. You only get out the card you need at the time you need it and then you secure it.
There's two reasons not to use a system like OpenID: technical ineptitude or collection of demographic information
The latter seems to be applicable at ATS, but given their past history of being hacked I wouldn't totally discount the former, either. :smokin:
I wasn't remarking about passwords, just the fact that nothing is really secure from certain people.
As far as openId, somewhat of a good idea, convenient, but one compromise breaks everything.
or collection of demographic information
which is worth big $$$
Bitchkoma
05-26-2009, 02:50 PM
or collection of demographic information
which is worth big $$$
Link it to stars and you have more than just basic information. Only one star per post per useraccount. Springer was mighty defensive when www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread306146/pg1]I (http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:sHZm4tW4184J:[url) asked about it[/url]. Probably the post that got me on their watch list.
skunk
05-26-2009, 03:05 PM
Ha...(from BK's link)
reply posted on 30-9-2007 @ 06:14 PM by Springer
You can rest assured we are NOT "gathering data" on what posts get starred or any other possible data set for that matter. We don't even keep server logs.
Seriously, with all that is so MUCH MORE important for us to do WHY would we bother with stuff like this?
We are OPPOSED to the gathering and sharing of member data at our core, all it takes is reading our privacy statement to understand that.
Springer...
Majic
But yeah, like Springer said, the stars are pretty much anonymous...
Is this user a sharp or what.
It's not anonymous at the member level. No magic in Majic.
Cogburn
05-26-2009, 05:52 PM
or collection of demographic information
which is worth big $$$
Link it to stars and you have more than just basic information. Only one star per post per useraccount. Springer was mighty defensive when www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread306146/pg1]I (http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:sHZm4tW4184J:[url) asked about it[/url]. Probably the post that got me on their watch list.
Think of it this way...
Take your stars, flags, own threads and own replies, then remove all articles, prepositions, and verbs and nouns that have a commonality of greater than 30% in common English usage.
What's left?
A keyword set that defines your conspiracy theory interests.
Data mining ATS would be fun as hell.
Data mining ATS would be fun as hell.
and theres the rub, as much as ats deny it the fact is that since the demise of the IAO govt agencies have been working feverishly on ways to increase there intelligence gathering through the use of the internet.
data mining is god.
and the humble servants of this new god are entities like in-q-tel, bbn tech, infragard and the companies that manage and own entities like TRUSTe, fastclick, casale media and so on, all of which can be traced to having the same few men and women participating in their management structure through aquisition.
for springer to also suggest "why would we bother with stuff like this" is ingenious in the extreme. the answer is readily apparent when you see the huge amounts of money entities like google and yahoo are prepared to pay for consumer information.
that is why you would bother with stuff like this, as well he would know if he's half the business man he claims to be.
they may not have any direct involvement in sharing/selling user information but to suggest that they are a safe haven from it occuring is unmitigated bullshit.
Cogburn
05-27-2009, 03:57 AM
Yeah... notice it was Springer and not Irvine that said something so stupid.
If Irvine said it and not that douche Springer it would mean to potential investors that they are not data mining a site with over 1,000,000 page views a month and anyone looking to dump cash into the next WebMD that ATS probably won't be it.
Honestly... the fact that Springer even said something like that would indicate to me that it is in fact happening. It makes the morons shut up while Irvine can still tell investors that his goldmine is still in operation.
skunk
01-02-2010, 08:36 PM
Bump.
anarch
01-02-2010, 09:25 PM
You know I was just getting turned on to infragard the other day. Here there somewhere... Watched a few Ventura stories about it. Seems fucked up enough.. Conspiracy crap aside the fact that those fucks can tap an FIB investigation on to you should you piss one of them off... And what is their policy for outdated infrastructure?
TV is on its way out. Pager companies are dead. Newspaper is a dying medium(Even if some of us will always insist on paper news). What of the members whos bussiness is no longer an important part of our infrastructure? Do they get kicked out?
Lexion
01-02-2010, 09:27 PM
Watched a few Ventura stories about it.
That made me chuckle.
Jesse is like GLP on TV.
anarch
01-02-2010, 09:42 PM
Yaup Caught it all on youtube bringing me back to my point about TV. Its a dying interface (To say nothing about the death of Antenna TV) . You know At least one TV mogul if not MANY are a part of Infragard. But TV IS a dying medium. Like pagers. So if an infragard member no longer maintains a service that is vital to the infrastructure do they boot him out? Is he grandfathered in?
If Anonymous threatened to hi jak the digital airwaves would over the air broadcasters get a special warning? OR would anyone even give a shit?
......
I miss analog.
Infinite`Eternal`Forever
01-03-2010, 02:02 AM
Yeah... notice it was Springer and not Irvine that said something so stupid.
Not surprising.